3.4 and requests for root password

[wernst]

So, this is new.

When I try to run something that requires root access from the K menu, such as QTParted, I get the bouncing-icon-cursor, and then the following dialog box:

I need the root's password to run:
/usr/sbin/qtparted
Password:____________

No password I try, including no password, works. Version 3.3 didn't prompt me for this.

Now I know I can run a command prompt and go superuser (with no password needed) and type "qtparted" and it runs. I know I can also change the root's password to something and type that password in when prompted.

I am trying to avoid this.

So, any tips to either eliminate the password prompt OR does anyone know what I should type at that password prompt to make things work straight away?

Thanks,
Warr

[nishtya]

wernst, if the first dialog that pops up on clicking on the menu item doesn't give an option usually in lower corner, for "adminstrator mode" like say, guarddog or in the kcontrol printer config - You can start from the command line (go to shell/console you like) and preface the command with "sudo". As in "sudo knoppix-installer". It will bring up a gui but you will be as if root. Am assuming live CD here. On the live CD the user default of knoppix has sudo rights. Let us know if you have a hd install and have made a new user.

[wernst]

All,

This is on the live-CD. Look, you can try it youself and observe what I am seeing very easily. Are you saying that you aren't prompted for a password given the same situation?

-Warr

[nishtya]

wernst, I will go now to spare machine and give it a go exactly as you are to see what is happening.

I have run the live CD with 2.6 kernel and was disappointed about sound, but everything else seemed ok.

I didn't check out too much of the KDE menu, there are 2-3 bugs in newer KDE and one of them involves su-ing :) I am going to go see if it got into the new Knoppix.

Nish - maybe noob but running a lotta debian distros and a staunch KDE fan

[nishtya]

wernst, I just booted on live CD using cheats knoppix26 and noscsi. Went to the the KDE menu and attempted the QTparted and saw the pw message. I understand what you are saying, but have to tell you I wouldn't start such an app through that route. I went to CIL, typed in sudo qtparted and the gui for that came up without any errors. Not sure how to advise you in pursuing issue on the live CD, but the CIL certainly works in this situation on live CD and I have a gut feeling the problem isn't the KDE menu bugginess but just live CD life.

[nishtya]

PS here: pardon this nearly-blind old arthritic lady for typos and the occasional "grey moment" regarding acronyms and senile dyslexia. I am not kidding when I say I don't really think I have the time to learn linux like I wish I could. I rely on clipboard utilites when I can't type worth a damn (ok, that is a lot of the time :) ). Yes, I am old but trying hard to prove that an old dog can learn new linux :lol: At least I am not pining for the good ol' window 3.1 days :lol: that's next :wink:

[eco2geek]

PS here: pardon this nearly-blind old arthritic lady for typos and the occasional "grey moment" regarding acronyms and senile dyslexia.

Come on, Nish, why do you want to destroy my mental image of you? 8) Sigh.


When I try to run something that requires root access from the K menu, such as QTParted, I get the bouncing-icon-cursor, and then the following dialog box [...] No password I try, including no password, works. Version 3.3 didn't prompt me for this.

First: Yes, it did too prompt you for a root password when you tried to run any administrative utilities requiring root privileges on Knoppix v3.3. That's not a Knoppix feature; that's a KDE feature. (And a Gnome feature. And hopefully a feature of any properly configured X window manager.)

KDE (or any other window manager) not asking for a root password when starting an administrative utility requiring root permissions, unless already being run as root, would be a serious bug.

Second, the reason it asks you for a root password is that the command that starts QTParted up is kdesu qtparted (note the "kdesu"). I don't know why you'd want to start QTParted as the normal user, since you wouldn't have the necessary permissions to do much. But you can always make a link to it on your desktop.

And when starting up that way, it'll say, "No device found. Maybe you're not using root user?"

[Cuddles]

O M G !

Doing something that requires "root" priviledge, that doesn't ask for it if you don't have it? Yikes, it sure does sound like a "security" problem. Just imagine a user in a company, like the "guy" working in the shipping department, starting up some program that they should never have had the rights to running, and worse, doing who knows what to the "company" system.

I know, I know, I am only running a single user computer, so this situation isn't a concern. But Linux is designed as a user protected system, not like Win98, and the ones before. In Win98, you were God, if you trashed your system, it was your fault, if you networked a Win98 system, most users on the system were also God. With Linux, like WinNT, you have users and permissions, hopefully setup so that the people who "need" to do what they "need" to do, can do it, but thats it - you don't go around with a "company" intranet system, and everyone has Root priviledges. Its just not safe.

Partitioning hard drives is not something I want a "guy in the shipping department" having access to doing, I would think a more "locked down" system thinking would be applied in the situation. I think the fact that you are being asked for SuperUser password is more of a "security" feature, than a hinderance. If anything, it causes me to "think twice", when I am asked for a password, before I go and just do it.

IMHO,
Cuddles

[nishtya]

I sometimes question the need for so much security myself, Cuddles. Single user system, too. But I have adjusted and just su in a console or use kdesu konqueror so I don't have to do a lot of typing to be cd-ing around. I have to admit I don't use the kmenu that much, so don't know how they set up a lot of the permissions/links in there for user. First install I had Firestarter for a firewall and it was annoying to have to keep starting it as root if I wanted to see it working.

[wernst]

First: Yes, it did too prompt you for a root password when you tried to run any administrative utilities requiring root privileges on Knoppix v3.3. That's not a Knoppix feature; that's a KDE feature. (And a Gnome feature. And hopefully a feature of any properly configured X window manager.)

Sigh.

Fortunately for everyone concerned, it is easy to TEST this. I just booted from my Knoppix 3.3 CD (in other words, Live on CD) and chose QTParted from the System menu. I WAS NOT PROMPTED FOR A PASSWORD. It fired right up and I was able to reformat the ext3 partition onto which I has installed the 3.4 CD 10 minutes before.

So obviously, something changed.

Really though, the problem I was writing about was not that I was being prompted for a password, but that THERE WAS NO PASSWORD I COULD TYPE THAT WOULD WORK. Certrainly I can use the console and log in, but that rather defeats the purpose of having a program listed in the K menu: it can never run from there.

Anyway, it seems like there is no solution other than running from the console. If anyone knows how to avoid this, I'd love to hear it.

-Warr

[nishtya]

you know what I just did for you? I booted up into my old knoppix 3.3 hd install. :lol: Anyway, there are 2 (countem, two) Qtparted entries in the System submenu of Kmenu. I tried clicking on both in turn and both had the same result, throbby flashy, timeout whatever nothing happens. Not being one to stop at that I went into the kdmenu editor to see what they were pointing at and as whom:

1) qtparted = /usr/bin/X11/xterm /usr/sbin/qtparted
2) qtparted = sudo -H qtparted

Not helpful, so I ran in console as normal user self and inputted and the results:

1)nish@ecs:~$ /usr/bin/X11/xterm /usr/sbin/qtparted
/usr/bin/X11/xterm: bad command line option "/usr/sbin/qtparted"

usage: /usr/bin/X11/xterm [-/+132] [-C] [-Sccn] [-T string] [-/+ah] [-/+ai]
[-/+aw] [-b number] [-/+bc] [-bcf milliseconds] [-bcn milliseconds]
[-bd color] [-/+bdc] [-bg color] [-bw number] [-/+cb] [-cc classrange]
[-/+cjk_width] [-class string] [-/+cm] [-/+cn] [-cr color] [-/+cu] [-/+dc]
[-display displayname] [-e command args ...] [-fa pattern] [-fb fontname]
[-/+fbb] [-/+fbx] [-fg color] [-fi fontname] [-fn fontname] [-fs size]
[-fw fontname] [-fwb fontname] [-fx fontname] [%geom] [#geom]
[-geometry geom] [-hc color] [-help] [-/+hold] [-iconic] [-/+ie] [-/+im]
[-into windowId] [-/+j] [-/+k8] [-/+l] [-/+lc] [-lcc path] [-leftbar]
[-lf filename] [-/+ls] [-/+mb] [-mc milliseconds] [-/+mesg] [-ms color]
[-n string] [-name string] [-nb number] [-/+nul] [-/+pc] [-/+pob]
[-rightbar] [-/+rv] [-/+rvc] [-/+rw] [-/+s] [-/+samename] [-/+sb] [-/+sf]
[-/+si] [-/+sk] [-sl number] [-/+sm] [-/+sp] [-/+t] [-ti termid]
[-title string] [-tm string] [-tn name] [-/+u8] [-/+ulc] [-/+ut] [-/+vb]
[-version] [-/+wc] [-/+wf] [-xrm resourcestring] [-ziconbeep percent]
Type /usr/bin/X11/xterm -help for a full description.

yeah, even less helpful

2)sudo -H qtparted
nish@ecs:~$ sudo -H qtparted
nish is not in the sudoers file. This incident will be reported.
nish@ecs:~$

Still not helpful though it shocked me. I am (was) not a sudoer? But then again, I never sudoed after hd install, only su.

There IS (was) a known bug on a KDE version around 3.2.1with su. See two grave regressions: http://www.kde.org/info/3.2.2.php#binary. With that bug, you su something in the KDE menu and although in the dialog you input right password, it says wrong password...sounds like your prob. But, the fact is what you say works fine for you in knoppix 3.3 give the above results for me knpx 3.3. Maybe it is something like a security hole left by an inbetween update then closed afterward (in 3.4 knoppix and I think, it's 3.2.1 KDE)?

Anyway, what you are saying is dead-on about knoppix 3.4. But I think you had either customized or a hole on your 3.3 install...mine was the knoppix version 2.19.04. Maybe upgrade KDE what you can and see it it is fixed?

[eco2geek]

The answer to your question is really simple, assuming that you're running live from the CD. Just make an icon for QTParted on your desktop, and for the command, put in sudo qtparted. Or edit its entry on the K Menu so that the command is sudo qtparted.

Probably work for all those other apps, too.

If you're running off a hard disk install, then there's probably no way around putting in a root password (you really don't want there to be, do you?).


Really though, the problem I was writing about was not that I was being prompted for a password, but that THERE WAS NO PASSWORD I COULD TYPE THAT WOULD WORK. Certrainly I can use the console and log in, but that rather defeats the purpose of having a program listed in the K menu: it can never run from there.

Of course not! If you installed any distro without setting a root password, you'd have the exact same problem. Since there are no default passwords set in Knoppix, you have to create a root password before you can use those programs from the K menu, by design.

Klaus could have altered the menu settings so that all of the programs that require root privileges ran from the K menu without asking for a password, but that would have required a lot of work to solve a problem that doesn't really exist.

(And I could swear that I didn't see QTParted on the menu anywhere when I ran KNOPPIX_V3.3-2004-02-16-EN. Sigh. It was kind of late.)

[Fabianx]

First: Yes, it did too prompt you for a root password when you tried to run any administrative utilities requiring root privileges on Knoppix v3.3. That's not a Knoppix feature; that's a KDE feature. (And a Gnome feature. And hopefully a feature of any properly configured X window manager.)

Sigh.

Fortunately for everyone concerned, it is easy to TEST this. I just booted from my Knoppix 3.3 CD (in other words, Live on CD) and chose QTParted from the System menu. I WAS NOT PROMPTED FOR A PASSWORD. It fired right up and I was able to reformat the ext3 partition onto which I has installed the 3.4 CD 10 minutes before.

So obviously, something changed.
-Warr

Hi,

to stop your war:

Yes, there has changed something and there will change more.

QTParted is now an official debian package (by me btw.) and you can't get an package into debian with knoppix hacks ...

Well so I had to add gksu and in the newer one su-to-root -X ...

cu

Fabian

PS: Use Alt+F2, "sudo qtparted" for now.

[eco2geek]

to stop your war

No war here, man! :roll:

[nishtya]

ahhh, so this is why upon upgrading my KDE on kanotix and guarddog started giving me the same trouble basically that wernst is having with qtparted was fixed when I upgraded gksu? (was afraid to post upgrade gksu for what seemed to be manifestation of a kde bug :lol: )

I love linux, rilly I do :)

And nope, no war here either :P