can I install to second HD - other has XP? i'm a dummy!!

[stuartc1]

Hi,

OK, im totally new to linux and have never installed it.

I currently run XP and have tried coLinux but had problems getting a network connection (I have a router). I have a spare HardDrive in my PC (x86) and would like to install Knoppix or Debian (are they the same?). I would have thought that since I have a DVD of knoppix and it runs like a dream with network working etc... that I could copy all these files to my free harddrive and away I go..... but I do not see any information on how to do this... I'm thinking it's not going to be that easy.

Please advise on how to install this on my second harddrive so I can boot to either XP or Linux.

Remember i'm new to linux (know a few basic commands) so nice easy help is what I need.

Please help :)

Regards,
Stuart

[user unknown]

a) knoppix and debian aren't the same.
Knoppix is meant to be a boot-from-cd system, but knoppix is a debian-based system, afaik.
For installation I would suggest the debian.
Else you allways get the same hardware redetected, configuration-files overwritten etc.
If you have the same dvd as I have, one side has the knoppix-boot system, and the other the debian-install system.

If you're going to install the knoppix-system, there should be a hd-install or similar called script.

Perhaps you need to create a filesystem on the second hd fiirst.

[robwelch100]

At the top of this web page are a series of tabs. One is labeled Docs. follow that page to install directions. Follow those directions for your install.

specifics on howTo install on your second hd: boot your dvd, when up and running hit ctrl-alt-F1 or 2 I forget which (you will exit the gui), type in knoppix-installer and it should walk you through the install. You can select what drive to istall to most likely you will be installing to /dev/hdb or some partition on hdb. (window is probably on hda1). As long as you select the right hard drive you should have no worries.

BTW I have this same setup, hda1 has WinXP, My second 40 GB hd has 3 diferent linux distros on it (hdb1=knoppix/ hdb3=Xandros/ hdb4=Suse9.1)and I'm going to do a 4th (Gentoo-just for the challenge).

Good luck.

[j.drake]

Hi,

OK, im totally new to linux and have never installed it.

I currently run XP and have tried coLinux but had problems getting a network connection (I have a router). I have a spare HardDrive in my PC (x86) and would like to install Knoppix or Debian (are they the same?). I would have thought that since I have a DVD of knoppix and it runs like a dream with network working etc... that I could copy all these files to my free harddrive and away I go..... but I do not see any information on how to do this... I'm thinking it's not going to be that easy.

Stuart, it IS that easy - don't make it hard. It's called using the "tohd" and "fromhd" cheatcodes (aka "poor man's install"), together with a persistent home, saved configuration and Klik. When you want Knoppix, stick in the CD, enter the cheatcodes to allow booting from an image on your hard drive and defined storage area, and you have a virtual hd installation that allows you to do pretty much anything you could do with a hd install, without the hassles. When you want Windows, reboot without the CD. You have the function and speed of a hd install combined with the safety and no-brainer simpliciy of running from live CD.

I'm working on a how-to for this, but for now, allow me to paste from another post I wrote.
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From what I've seen here (and in my own experience), most newbies soon get extremely frustrated at this point, and immediately want to do a hard drive dual boot install that won't mess up their Windows installation, try it without backups and other precautions, mess something up, scream and beg for help with incredible urgency (e.g., Windows won't run, spouse is angry, homework is due tomorrow, can't get into TurboTax on April 14th to finish return - you get the idea). It's a humbling experience, and many go back to Windows, never to return. But it doesn't have to be that way - you just need to think a little differently.

First, load the live CD and look around. Enjoy the tour - nothing bad will happen. If you want to go further, do not assume a hd install to be the next logical step - it isn't. You cannot do anything in MSWindows without installing to HD - not so with Knoppix. There is an option called setting up a "persistent home" directory. Think of it as kind of like "My Documents" and "Program Files", all in one. You set it up to take a portion of whatever storage device you want, to save files and programs. There is also an option to "Save configuration", so that when you set up your printer and change your desktop settings to do what you want, you won't have to do it all over again when you reboot. You will learn that if you enter "cheat codes" at bootup, the Knoppix CD will look for these saved files and configurations at startup, and serve them up to you. The easiest way to install other applications (Knoppix has quite a few built in, though), is to use Klik, and you will find out about that if you look for the "sticky" posts in the various forums. You will eventually realize that running your OS from a CD limits your ability to use your CD reader/burner for other uses, and you may be tempted to do a hd install at this point. Don't. There is another option which some call a "poor man's" install. Basically, you copy the CD to a file on a hard drive, without installing it, and use a cheat code (the "tohd" and "fromhd" cheatcodes) to tell Knoppix to install from that hd copy of the CD, instead of from the CD (you will still use the CD to get the boot prompt).

Using a combination of the "poor man's" install with persistent home and save configuration, you will have virtually the same capabilities available to you as with a hd install, but without the hassles. Don't feel as if you are "settling" for something less with this - this is the configuration I use now, and a lot of very knowledgable Knoppix users use this setup also (including the guy who invented Klik). As far as I'm concerned, it has all of the advantages of a hd install, and none of the disadvantages. And, when you decide to use Windows, simply reboot without sticking in the Knoppix CD, and you're back in Windows, just as if nothing had happened in Linux, until you're ready to boot back in to Linux and have it all back available to you.

And, for goodness sake, if you decide to do a hd install anyway, please defrag and backup all your Windows stuff first. As far as I can tell, the most likely consequence of a faulty Linux hdinstall is to mess up your bootloader, so that you can't get back in to Windows, and you might not know about Linux to fix it (or not care). SUre, you might be in the habit of skipping the backup advice when upgrading Windows, confident that nothing bad will happen, but odds are pretty significant that you could make a mistake with your first attempt at a dual boot linux hdinstall.

So, that's kind of an overview of what to expect. If you want specific details, there are lots of posts and WIKIs to guide you if you use the search box at the top of the page.

__________________________________________________ ___________

Read for yourself the frustrations of experienced Linux users doing a hd install. People with hundreds of posts under their names spending weeks and months to get it right. Worse yet, people with very few posts pleading for help with a botched install. It doesn't have to be that way. I use this method, and so do a lot of other people.

From another post of mine - a few details:

__________________________________________________ ___________


For those who haven't looked into this, a poor man's install is pretty much the same as running off of a live CD, but it's faster, and potentially more convenient, plus, it frees up your CD or DVD drive for other things, such as burning a disk - can't do that with live CD unless you have another drive. Of course you still have to do a persistent home (PH) and save your configuration in order to install applications or keep your printer definition between sessions, but that's easy.

There is no necessity to partition your media, but you could. If you don't want to partition, just save your PH as a file wherever you like. Running Knoppix off of CD, click the penguin icon on the toolbar, and click Configure. From there, you can see the links to set up a persistent home, and to save your configuration. Do the PH now (then the save configuration if you want), log off and restart.

Boot the CD with whatever cheatcodes you use, but include the following cheatcode as well (I'll use hdb5 as the example for where I want the HD install located - NOTE: this is NOT THE SAME THING as the ISO file you downloaded, but you can put it in the same location if you wish): "tohd=/dev/hdb5/". So, if you created your persistent home at the hdb5 partition, your boot might look like this: "knoppix26 home=/dev/hdb5 myconfig=scan tohd=/dev/hdb5", or if you saved your PH as a file and didn't partition, it might be: "knoppix26 home=scan myconfig=scan tohd=/dev/hdb5 The boot process will copy the image there and continue booting off the CD. Check to make sure that your configuration was saved and that your persistent home set up OK. If not, try setting them up again now. Log off and restart.

This time, you want to restart and append the cheatcode "fromhd=/dev/hdb5". For example, "knoppix26 home=scan myconfig=scan fromhd=/dev/hdb5". It should now be a lot faster, and you can remove the CD until the next time you boot.
__________________________________________________ ___________

From here, you can install Klik to download and install popular programs (there's a sticky post about it at the top of the News forum).

If you are indeed totally new to Knoppix, you don't want to take on a hd install, and you don't need the hassle of doing it just to have a usable system that runs from your hd. The fact that your DVD runs like a dream indicates that you should have no problems, since you will be using exactly the same autodetection and defaults, except that you will be able to make and save basic modifications without script editing.

jd

[stuartc1]

Well thanks for all the encouragement guys, I feel much more comfortable now. I did notice the cheat’s thing on the DVD (I got the DVD with Linux Magazine) so thanks for pointing out what it is. I'm going to go with the poor-mans-install and see how it goes.

The main reason I want Linux is that I do a lot of programming in PHP and have my sites on Linux. I know the bare minimum to get my sites running on it, but would like to set-up a test environment and also learn a bit more about the operating system. I just hope after I get it running I can install things like PHP and MySQL with little bother *fingers crossed*.

Thanks again, and a special thanks to JD for spending the time to collate your other posts :)

No doubt I will be back with more problems soon ;)

Cheers,
Stuart