Sub-Newbie-Level-Question

[Wraithen]

Hey,

First off, let me make it clear that I'm a complete newbie to Linux, and due to a very ... intermittent, self-tutoring with computers, there are likley to be several basic concepts that I've missed completley, if you're impatient, turn back now before you flame me :wink:

Ok, I've downloaded the Knoppix v3.2 .iso from one of the mirrors, it's 700mb and I'm more concerned with getting that working than making sure it's correct with the .md5 that's with it (ahh, gotta love that irony).

I am unsure how to burn Knoppix to a CD under winXP, I'm using Nero, but so far the 2cds I've burnt are just coasters, they just hang the bootup until I take them out of the drive.

So, anyone with enough time and generosity to explain EXACTLY what a .ISO is, and why they're important to Linux, how to burn a bootable one, and anything else on that kinda level or above that they think I should know, please, tell me.

Thanks,
-W.

[RockMumbles]

IIRC with nero you cannot use the wizard, look for "burn image" or something of the sort, in "burn image" window look in the filetype dropdown and it should have iso as an optional file type.

BTW I haven't used nero in about 2 years, but I've read about using it, also check the "Docs" here for one on writing cd's, if not here look on knopper's site in his documentation.

An iso is an image of a cd, nothing linux "special", it is a file that is a "copy" of an entire bootable cd with full directory structure, etc.

rock

[rickenbacherus]

While it is technically possible to use the Nero wizard it's a pain in the arse- just close it click file>burn image then browse to your image. That's it. Rock is right- an .iso is just an image and is not particular to one operating system or the other.

[revividus]

As pretty much a newbie myself, I can testify that this is very easy if you are using Nero -- I used it myself just this morning. Though I didn't bother with the checksum.

The easiest way (though you have probably done it by now, and are trying to configure ppp just so you can see this page again) is to just quit the wizard, go to file-->burn image, browse to your image, and click OK.

In the "what exactly is an ISO" dept, as far as I understand it, an ISO is an exact binary "picture" (hence term, image) of a cd. It's different in that when you make a normal copy of data it is not an exact binary copy; in fact, if you make copies of your copies of your copies, you will soon wind up with a disc you can't install from. It will slowly become corrupted. An ISO circumvents this problem by being an exact duplicate of the image on the cd.

Hope this is helpful to you or anyone else with the same question.

[VeeDubb]

My vote is this is an Occam's razor type of problem. Try burning the ISO at a lower speed. Sometimes, especialy with a "cheaper" CD burner, they make lots of errors when burning large CD's

As for what an ISO is, I'll give you the painfully plain english answer. It's a snap-shot of a CD. Programs like Nero or Roxio use it to make a CD. There is csoftware out there for people with more know-how to mount it as a real CD and with the correc6t software, you computer can't tell the differnce between a Cd in a drive and an ISO on your had-drive.

As for making it bootable, you don't have to do anything, the .ISO for knoppix is a snap-shot of a bootable CD, so any CD you make with it will also be bootable.

Why are the important to linux? It's a universal standard that almost all CD burning programs recognize, and if you're just starting with the data, instead of an image ofthe CD, then making it bootable is more complicated and not all burning programs an do it.

As for people being patient, the last time I tried to switch to linux, the impatiens of the community was the biggest thing that made me give up. But not so here. I have been nothing but impressed with how helpfull people are, so keep post, (be sure you search first) and those who allready know more will help you and as I learn I will help newcommers as well. That's how a good community forum works.

[rickenbacherus]

Typically what happens (myself included) is that the first time you burn an .iso you actually burn the file. Then you put the disk in and it won't boot. You look at it with a file browser and see something there, the cd burning software gave no errors and now you're really scratching your head. Oh well, let's try it again - I probably just set something wrong but instead you make another coaster. That's what my .iso education cost me anyway. :) While I'm rambling - you'll likely see .iso's that are larger than the reported capacity of the media. Scorching one of these on disk is called 'overburning'. Some media can handle it some drives can handle it. I have never had a problem burining an extra 20 or 30 MB. The only way to find out is to give it a whirl. Of course don't try it with important data e.g. a backup disk unless you test your burn.

[Wraithen]

Ok, reading the replies (thanks) and having talked to a friend today, has provoked another question:

I know that it is possible to burn an .ISO in two different ways, one is burning the .ISO to a cd, which, for simplicity's sake, is a file on a CD.

The other is to ..., I'm trying to think of a suitable word, to "integrate" the .ISO to the cd, so you have ... well I suppose you could describe it as an .ISO mounted onto the CD, if you don't follow, sorry, best I could do.

For those who did follow, which of the 2 ways is the one to use to burn Knoppix? I believe it's the 2nd.

[rickenbacherus]

Open NERO- close the wizard. Click FILE>Burn Image. Browse to your .iso hit OK and you're off.

[Dave_Bechtel]

--It's the 2nd. When you do a directory listing on the CD, you're supposed to see the Knoppix stuff - not the single file ending in .iso.

--This will become clearer when you master the mount command in Linux, and mount the iso over loopback to get at its contents. ;-)

' mkdir /mnt/cdtemp '
' touch /mnt/cdtemp/NOTHERE '
' ls /mnt/cdtemp '
' mount KNOPPIX.ISO /mnt/cdtemp -oloop,ro '
' ls /mnt/cdtemp '

--Notice that the first LS shows the NOTHERE file. After mounting the ISO, the NOTHERE is nowhere to be found - it is overlaid by the mounted filesystem, as are all other files that might be in /mnt/cdtemp. After you ' umount ' the /mnt/cdtemp, the NOTHERE will reappear. While the ISO is mounted, you can access it just as if it was a mounted cdrom.

--This procedure also works with other filesystems. :) You can make (dd) a file of XX megabytes, do a mke2fs on it, and mount it.

--If you want to be really scary, you can do this: (I know you're a newbie, but this can help other ppl - and you can always come back to it later)

1. make a 200-megabyte file
2. Create an ext2 filesystem on it
3. Mount the file over loopback
4. Copy files to the new filesystem
5. Unmount it
6. BURN THE FILE TO CD using cdrecord... (using mkisofs or just burn it as raw data)
7. mount the new cd (if you used mkisofs)
8. mount the ext2 file on the cd (or just mount -t ext2 /dev/cdrom... if raw)

(The details are left as an exercise to the reader... :b Doncha just hate that phrase)

--Presto! Instead of an ISO, you are now accessing an ext2 filesystem read-only from cdrom! :twisted:


Ok, reading the replies (thanks) and having talked to a friend today, has provoked another question:

I know that it is possible to burn an .ISO in two different ways, one is burning the .ISO to a cd, which, for simplicity's sake, is a file on a CD.

The other is to ..., I'm trying to think of a suitable word, to "integrate" the .ISO to the cd, so you have ... well I suppose you could describe it as an .ISO mounted onto the CD, if you don't follow, sorry, best I could do.

For those who did follow, which of the 2 ways is the one to use to burn Knoppix? I believe it's the 2nd.