View Full Version : Hardrive install

02-25-2005, 10:24 PM
My Laptop Stats:
Dell Latitude CPi A400XT
Pentium II
Math Comprocessor: Integrated
Video Memory 2.5MB
BIOs Level: A08
Hardrive no1: 2.92GB
Hardrive no2: 2.51GB

Im using Knoppix 3.6 but its really slow using it from the cd-rom how can i transfer it to hardrive?

Harry Kuhman
02-25-2005, 10:28 PM
Do you really have a laptop with 2 hard drives in it, or is it one hard drive with 2 partitions?

Will this be a Linux only install (no Windows any more)?

02-26-2005, 09:50 PM
yeah it really does have 2 hardrives i know its crazy :roll: , yeah id get rid of windows its running 95 so no point having that anymore, it will just waste space on the hardrives

Harry Kuhman
02-26-2005, 09:58 PM
yeah it really does have 2 hardrives i know its crazy :roll: , yeah id get rid of windows its running 95 so no point having that anymore, it will just waste space on the hardrives
OK, good luck to you. Those that believe that Knoppix can and should be installed to a hard drive have enough information to join in now. I believe differently and would go for a Debian install rather than Knoppix.

02-26-2005, 11:33 PM
i would go for the debian netinstall. i did this the other day on a real old machine.

64mb ram 286mhz. and it works like a dream

02-27-2005, 12:50 AM
y is debian better?

02-27-2005, 01:01 AM
y is debian better?

Yes and no. Essentially, Knoppix is Debian once installed to hard drive (at least, using the Debian Install option). But it isn't as suitable for low ram systems as Debian (from an "orthodox") install can be. There can also be issues with apt-get (but these can be pretty much overcome).

On the plus side, a Knoppix/Debian Install to HD gives you much more up to date packages than in Debian Stable and is generally easier.

Of course, we can then move onto the political issues and Knoppix containing non-free packages.................... (but I'd sooner not!)[/quote]

Harry Kuhman
02-27-2005, 01:03 AM
y is debian better?Debian is intended for hard drive install. It takes alittle more work to get it up, but when you do you should have a nice solid system.

Knoppix is first and foremost a Live CD. To get the magic they did and fit all of it on one 700 meg CD a number of "tricks" were pulled, including mixing parts and pieces from several different releases. If you read through the subject lines of this forum (one of the bussiest forums on this website) you'll find that many people have problems with things that used to work fine from the CD but no longer work after a hard disk install. And upgrading tends to break more things, as the tricky ballance of stable, unstable and experimental parts is broken. Read the forum and see what other have experienced or try it yourself (you can always wipe it out and try Debian later), the choice is up to you.

02-27-2005, 05:46 AM
y is debian better? It's not that Debian is better than Knoppix or Fedora or GoboLinux or the more than 300 other Linux distributions you can find on distrowatch.com - it's what suits you better. :D

(By the way, Knoppix is a Debian system. This is espeically evident after it's installed to hard drive because it checks for updates at Debian websites.)

Most (one hopes) of these distros were designed to fill a certain niche, so it helps to start by looking at what you want versus what's being offered. Sometimes you'll easily find more than one that fits the bill, and you can think and analyze and test to your heart's content.

If you want a big, well-supported Linux for your company, for example, Red Hat Enterprise, Mandrake, and SuSE would be the ones to start with. Fortunately, at the other end of the scale, there are also distros tuned for computers with limited resources like yours. Finding them isn't quite as easy as it could be, but poke around on this forum and others, see what people are talking about, and ask some questions.

As mentioned, Knoppix is really designed to be run from CD, so it has weaknesses once you get out of that realm. It can be useful in a situation like yours with somewhat limited space on hard drives because nearly everything's on the CD. But then you're booting from CD every time, which can get annoying.

Klaus Knopper came up with Knoppix because he didn't want to carry around a laptop. He thought it would be much easier to just carry a CD that he could pop into any random computer that was nearby and do his work there.

(With all the work involved in maintaining a world-wide phenomenon, I'll bet he wishes he'd gone with a laptop! :D)

One side effect of this is that Knoppix has superior hardware detection (and automatic configuration). That part's good when dealing with the three challenges of your situation - limited resources, older equipment, and laptops (which manage to cram stuff into a smaller box by taking liberties with the hardware).

Another side effect is that there's a whale of a lot of software loaded onto that disk. That's not so good when it comes to installing to small hard drives.

You can do it - Knoppix would just fit on one of your drives. Then you'd probably want to free up space by tossing out duplicate applications (how many text editors do you really need - and is emacs one of them?) and maybe moving some of your setup over to the other drive.

But, as mentioned, managing the programs on an installed Knoppix is harder than on, say, an installed pure Debian because of that mix of sources. Once Knoppix is installed, it defaults to only getting upgrades from the testing stream ("release") of Debian.

This can be changed, of course. But over time, the installed mix of programs would tend to become more and more pure "testing." That would be a long-term benefit, though, that probably wouldn't make up for the short-term pain.

If you're not familiar with Debian releases, here's a short-short overview:stable is what the Debian developers stand behind. It can take a long (long, long!) time for stuff to enter the stable release, so this will always be behind what other distros offer;
testing is where the final bugs get worked out before entering stable - it's actually good stuff, just not quite ready for the developers to stand behind;
unstable is the stage before testingand there are a variety of other sources of Debian-oriented packages that don't make it into the three official streams. Some are experimental (a stage less reliable than unstable), some are from developers who take issue with Debian/GNU licensing requirements, some are flat-out proprietary, some might violate export restrictions if downloaded from a U.S. repository by a user outside North America.

:!: Note that Debian only issues security patches for software in the stable release! :!:

If you decide to try Debian (and why not - it's a decent place to start) you might want to install from Debian disks instead of Knoppix, to avoid the mix of releases.

My computers usually have a few pieces of hardware that don't get detected correctly by average distros, including Debian. As a minimum, I can't run X windows until I pound on the video or mouse configurations for a while.

But I was pleasantly surprised by Debian's net-install setup. You download one iso that's just over 100 MB, use that to configure the base system, then Debian uses apt to go off and get the rest of what you want to install.

Yes, this depends heavily on using the net. But if your connection is slow or unreliable, you don't have to start from the beginning again when the download fails in the middle of a 600-MB CD image.

The official release of net-install give you a pure testing system, but they point you to places to get a stable version. So far I'm liking it a lot. I only had to tweak one setting to get better resolution on my monitor, and I cheated - I copied the configuration over from my Knoppix installation. :D

Give it some thought, but know that Linux is a good choice for laptop!

-- Ed

02-27-2005, 07:04 AM
I only had to tweak one setting to get better resolution on my monitor, and I cheated - I copied the configuration over from my Knoppix installation. Very Happy

hehe i had to do the same thing i didnt do xconfig correclty first few times around and i thought to my self. it works in knoppix , dsl , kanotix etc. so i copied it :D worked perfectly.

you could also give kanotix a test out for hd install. its based purely on debian sid and i havent come across any major errors at all with kanotix hd install.

03-13-2005, 08:07 PM
I have a Dell Inspiron 8000 with a ATI M4 Mobility Rage video card, and let me tell you that finding a distrobution of linux that supports this hardware is not an easy task; And the ones that do support my video rarely support everything else (eg. My PCMCIA cards, netgear MA401 WLAN & a Xircom all-in-one)

Mandrake & Redhat support my hardware, but, I despise those two (Horrible systems, just terrible)
Gentoo likes my video card just fine, but has a known bug with the yenta_socket drivers, so I'm forced to use a stage3 (automated) install, which isn't nice.
Debian Sarge, Woody & Patato all hate my video cards. To date I've not gotten anything but WOODY Vanilla boot to even go past the boot loader when installing from CD.

Even BSD distrobutions have problems with my hardware, specifically my video and USB.

This is where Knoppix has seperated itself from all those distrobutions; I've been using knoppix for several months now and have only encountered one situation on any computer i've used it on where it failed to detect hardware (A very, very, very old PCI Ethernet card I slapped into my Gateway 455mhz)

I have been using the knoppix hdd install very successfully for a number of months now. Only problems I've faced are neverending amounts of user error on my part.

I've also had much luck USING knoppix to install other distrobutions. For instance, when I installed Gentoo on one of my desktops, I simply used knoppix to chroot and install when gentoo failed to recognize some of my hardware.

If you have limited harddrive space, I'd go with a basic install of debian (You might also try installing DamnSmallLinux. Never used it, though.) If you have hardware problems like I do, then look into the step I just mentioned, using knoppix to install the other distrobution.

PS. If you plan to use knoppix hdd install, watchout for apt-get update! Knoppix has it's own configuration files for boot up, and debian likes to create new ones where it thinks they should go. Happened to me, And I'm STILL cleaning up the mess debian made. :)