Knoppix 4.0 makes my dvd-drive BenQ DW-1640 crash!

[Jackie78]

Hi,

I just tried to boot the brand new Knoppix Linux 4.0 DVD with my BenQ 1640 dvd-writer attached to my Asus A8V motherboard (Secondary Master).

Knoppix starts to boot from that DVD, but then stops with an error saying
"Accessing Knoppix DVD at /dev/hdc.......insmod: error inserting modules/kloop.co' -1: bad file.
Booting stops at that point.

Now comes the interesting part: from this point on, the drive is hanging, neither does it eject the dvd, nor does it stop spinning. It can also not be recognized by the system bios anymore (no device), even pressing reset doesn't help. The only way to reactivate the drive in this state is to switch off the whole system and switch it on again. Up to now, I cannot say if there are any permanent damages to my drive, but it seems to be a temporary problem.

I am now interested in the following:
- can anybody reproduce what my experience?
- can anybody tell me what happend here, and whom to blame?

If you need more information let me know.

cu,

Jackie

[UnderScore]

- can anybody reproduce what my experience?
- can anybody tell me what happend here, and whom to blame?
I got my NEC ND-3540A DVD burner today. Popped into the system, upgraded the firmware from cdfreaks and then burned Knoppix 4.01 on a Verbatiam DVD+R at 8x speed. It took about 8 minutes to burn. The burned DVD+R works perfectly in my system.

How did you get the DVD ISO file? Did you use bitttorrent or did you download from a web or ftp mirror? If you did not use bitttorrent, have you checked either the MD5 or the SHA1 checksums & made sure the DVD ISO file is perfect & not corrupt? You might be wondering: "Why would you want to prove that it is a perfect download or that the DVD was burned perfectly?" The answer is: If the ISO that was downloaded has a small error, or if the DVD was burned on bad media, or if the DVD was burned too fast, it will result in crashes, lockups, and strange errors. We have seen this happen consistenly for years.

These types of questions are all documented at the Downloading FAQ http://www.knoppix.net/wiki/Downloading_FAQ. So how can we help you? Perhaps you have already done them but you must do some simple tests to rule out the chances that the DVD or ISO download is the cause of the problems. If you choose not to do those tests, then there is no way we can help you determine the cause of the problems.

You asked about "whom to blame". Please see the Disclaimer (http://www.knoppix.net/wiki/General_FAQ#Q:_What_else_is_there_to_be_aware_of.3 F).

[Jackie78]

Hi,

as I alreaday mentioned, the dvd is working perfectly, I can boot it flawlessly on other machines, or copy it to another one. The Md5 sums of course match, I check that regularely before burning an image. The image is from the torrent networtk of course, or is there another official source already?

I want to point out again that the problem is not that the software crashes, my major concern is that a piece of hardware (in this case my dvd drive) crashes after trying to boot knoppix. I can reproduce that behaviour here anytime.

What really makes me wonder is why knoppix is trying to access that device as /dev/hdc - does it think my dvd drive is a harddrive an use a wrong routine to access?

Please also note that after the knoppix splash-screen where I can select the boot , the error-message mentioned above is the first (and only) message I receive.

[UnderScore]

I apologize for you having to repeat yourself. I should have read your post better.
I am sorry that all I can say is wow. I have never heard of a working optical disc that can lock a system up but it is now certainly within the realm of possiblities.

[pixxelle]

I have a similar problem with my new Plextor DVD R-RW PX-740A.

I discovered this while trying to install Ubuntu 5.04, and then after its failure did a comparison with my KNOPPIX 3.8.1 live cd which had worked previously before adding the newer drive. All were MD5'd successfully and on name brand media.

After a lot of scrolling I got this...

end_request: I/O error, dev hdc, sector 745056
Buffer I/O error on dev hdc, logical block 186264
hdc:drive not ready for command
cloop: read error at pos 37817527 in file /cdrom/KNOPPIX/KNOPPIX, 34592 bytes lost
cloop: read error -3 uncompressing block 16086
65536/0/34592/0 378317527-378352119
Buffer I/O error in device cloop0, logical block 514778
Bus error /linuxrc: cannot create /var/run/utmp:dir nonexistent
kernel panic - not syncing: VFS:unable to mount root fs on unknown block (1,3)

So I'm dead in the water until I put another CD drive in my Dell Optiplex. Maybe I'll see if there is a firmware update.

[edit: a bit later...] So here's something interesting I happened to dig up. My Plextor has the same chipset as the BenQ 1640 listed in this thread! Go look here. http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdoc.aspx?i=2482&p=2 A firmware upgrade for me didn't help. I think we're both hosed... bummer... :(

[Jackie78]

Hi,

the Benq 1640 and the Plex 740 are identical hardware, only their firmware is different!

But still I am very sure that the problem is not caused by a defective media, my DVD is flawlessly right ;)

Since you got a Dell PC, I doubt that the rest of our hardware is comparable, I have an Athlon XP64 on an Asus A8V Board. So it seems we have to make the drive (firmware?) or Knoppix responsible for that behaviour. Maybe one of the Knoppix developers can have a closer look?

cu,

Jackie

[pixxelle]

>>Maybe one of the Knoppix developers can have a closer look? <<

Well, since both Knoppix and Ubuntu are related to Debian, maybe Debian developers in general might want to have a look.

So I'm gonna put another older drive in my box. Since we do have quite disparate hardware 'cept for the DVD drives, my opinion is that the drive *is* the problem here.

I might try another distro that is not Debian related, just for kicks...

Good luck to you.

[UnderScore]

end_request: I/O error, dev hdc, sector 745056
Buffer I/O error on dev hdc, logical block 186264
hdc:drive not ready for command
cloop: read error at pos 37817527 in file /cdrom/KNOPPIX/KNOPPIX, 34592 bytes lost
cloop: read error -3 uncompressing block 16086
65536/0/34592/0 378317527-378352119
Buffer I/O error in device cloop0, logical block 514778
Bus error /linuxrc: cannot create /var/run/utmp:dir nonexistent cloop errors usually indicate that the CD/DVD media itself is bad or was burned too fast. Evidence of this can be (http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14286) found in these forums. (http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=17104) You can search the forum or see a google search (http://www.google.com/search?q=cloop+error+site%3Aknoppix.net).

Then again it may be related to a Knoppix problem. There will be a 4.02 bug fix release soon. (http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20612)

[Jackie78]

The DVD media is perfectly all right, it is a Knoppix problem, not one with the dvd!

[Jackie78]

Problem still persists, anybody can give any more hint? All I can say Ubuntu Live CD works!

[justThisGuy]

on a Benq 1640 (BSJB) on an Intel D845PEBT2 motherboard.

It works great under Windows 2000 (reading and writing disks works fine).

Interestingly enough I can boot an old version of Knoppix (kernel 2.4). It won't boot later knoppix's or a Suse 9.3 or Ubuntu 5.04 installer. (*I can't even boot off the LiveCD*)

I installed Ubuntu 5.04 by adding an old CD drive to my machine, but now if I try and read dvd's on the benq I get the following error, especially when I try and read longer files:

hdc: cdrom_read_intr: Bad transfer size 65534
This drive is not supported by this version of the driver
end_request: I/O error, dev hdc, sector 28360
Buffer I/O error on device hdc, logical block 7090
hdc: status error: status=0x58 { DriveReady SeekComplete DataRequest }
hdc: status error: error=0x00
hdc: drive not ready for command
hdc: status error: status=0x58 { DriveReady SeekComplete DataRequest }
hdc: status error: error=0x00
hdc: drive not ready for command
hdc: status error: status=0x58 { DriveReady SeekComplete DataRequest }
hdc: status error: error=0x00
hdc: drive not ready for command
hdc: status error: status=0x58 { DriveReady SeekComplete DataRequest }
hdc: status error: error=0x00
hdc: drive not ready for command
hdc: ATAPI reset complete

Anyone have an idea of why the transfer size might be so odd? Its almost a full word (FFFE) - perhaps there's some sort of overflow condition?

[pixxelle]

I put a plain vanilla CDR into my machine (Dell Optiplex GX260) and was able to boot into and install Ubuntu 5.04. I can also boot into Live Knoppix (3.8.1) with the older drive as it should.

I cannot play any DVD's with the Plextor 740A drive, although it will play audio (I have mostly the Gnome desktop). If I try to play a DVD, Ubuntu freezes so hard I have to shut down ungracefully.

Soooo, I'm not sure what I'm going to do for now with that drive. I haven't had the time to really play with other aspects like burning data and/or audio CD's. The Plextor drive does mount and even has correct info listed as to what it is, but DVD's? No. And I can't boot with it.

[ckamin]

Problem still persists, anybody can give any more hint? All I can say Ubuntu Live CD works!
One issue that some drives seem to have is media compatiblility. Some types of media, dyes, etc. work better in some drives than in others. I have encountered many issues where a drive will burn both DVD+ and DVD- media, but has trouble reading from one or the other. Try a different brand that is recommended by the drive manufacturer as compatible. The firmware is sometimes the culprit, but may never be upgraded to fix whatever errors you might be encountering. Burning speed IS an issue. You might appear to have a good burn at a higher speed, but reading that disc in ALL drives may not be a reality. Just because a disc works in ONE system does not mean that ALL systems SHOULD or WILL read that disc without errors. Cheap media, even some that claim to be "Name-Brand" is usually a big issue. There is a lot of sub-standard media on the market and if you got a "Good Deal" on it, there obviously was a reason. You can sometimes even see the errors on the media and uneven dye distribution.

To see if you can resolve your problem:

Try a different type of media than what you used before. A CD of retail or better quality, recommended by the drive manufacturer as compatible. DVD+R instead of -R, or vice versa, of a brand recommended by the drive manufacturer.

Burn the disc at the slowest speed possible. 1X is not too slow. See my post here for more: http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20751&highlight=

Be certain that you have the latest firmware update for your drive.

Be certain that the drive and media is clean and free of peanut butter and jelly fingerprints or the like.

Sometimes drives and systems have certain needs regarding jumper settings and cables. IE cable select/80 pin IDE cable supporting cable select option. Master or slave may make a difference when installed with other drives on the same controller or cable.

There very well could be an issue with Knoppix regarding certain drive/driver compatibilities. I have not heard of any, but that does not mean one does not exist. I would search the forums to see if there are others experiencing the same issues with those drives. I would try to reason that if Knoppix is affected, a similar debian based distro would encounter the same or similar errors with like versions/kernels. I do not have a Benq drive in my collection, so I could not try to duplicate your concern to investigate it further.

[AGraybosch]

Got the same exact problem with the same drive BENQ 1640... /dev/hda insmod: error inserting '/modules/cloop.ko' -1 bad file number. After the error the drive spins until I reboot and remove the DVD. I haven't tried the same DVD in any other drive but the burn was clean from Nero.

[AGraybosch]

No problems at all with the CD version.

[Harry Kuhman]

Got the same exact problem with the same drive BENQ 1640...
Oh, well in that case we'll post the fix. We wern't going to tell the other guy what was wrong, but since you have the exact same problem we'll go ahead and reveal the secret. Just give use a little time to write up the information in extreme detail.

[dubbz]

Is this some kind of problem with the BENQ DW-1640?

I get the same message when trying to boot the Live DVD (well, except that mine is hdb, not hda or hdc).

- Used BitTorrent to download it
- Did an extra md5 check ('just in case'... well, you never know *cough*)
- Burned with Nero 6 (at 2.4X, Verbatim DVD-R 16X media)
- Got the 'bad file number' error, system halts.
- Did a md5 check of all the files on the DVD (using the md5sum file in KNOPPIX dir), and all files check out fine.
- I tried to use 'knoppix testcd', but it doesn't get past the 'bad file number' part.

It's hooked up to a Shuttle SN25P (AMD64, nForce4). Firmware version on the DW-1640 is 'BSLB'.

Edit: For those with similar issues; What kind of media have you used? DVD-R or DVD+R? After googling a bit, I suspect that it might have some issues with DVD-R media, but I don't have any empty DVD+R at hand, so I can't check for myself.

[justThisGuy]

I can burn a disk with a different drive and it still fails when the Benq tries to boot off it under linux.

Better yet I can burn a disk with the Benq under windows that scans fine, boots fine in another DVD drive and the Benq still can't boot off it.

There's pretty clearly a problem between the Benq and a lot of 2.6 kernels running on various motherboards. Google "benq 1640 linux" or "plextor 740a dvd linux error" and see what you find. There are increasing numbers of problem reports coming out. Hopefully someone with some kernel hacking experience will notice...

[Harry Kuhman]

Better yet I can burn a disk with the Benq under windows that scans fine, boots fine in another DVD drive and the Benq still can't boot off it....
At what speed do you burn these discs?

[ckamin]

Assuming that the boot process gets far enough, Has anyone tried to enable DMA? Cheatcode is "Knoppix dma", if I remember correctly. I have experienced many issues with older Plextor drives under Windows wiithout DMA turned on. If I can remember correctly, there were a couple of occasions where the drive was basically locked and spinning until a hard reboot. I was not sure at the time if it was a software issue or the DMA not being enabled for some strange reason, but updating the burning software and turning on DMA seemed to cure it. Could it be possible that these drives have some issues under Linux in that regard? Just a SWAG, but might be worth the time to explore it.


There are increasing numbers of problem reports coming out. Hopefully someone with some kernel hacking experience will notice...
Has anyone done some verification and workup and reported this as a bug?

A quick look at BOTH the Plextor AND the BENQ sites did not provide any reason to believe that they claim these drives support Linux in any fashion. Plextor did have a page claiming that ALL of their CD-R/RW drives were supported in Linux, but there is no mention of the DVD drives. The Manuals/Specifications for the drives do not show Linux to be listed as a compatible Operating System. A quick search did not reveal any information on this issue either. Has anyone contacted the Drive manufacturers for assistance? They might nave more information available on their drive's issues with Linux or should be made aware of them.

[dubbz]

Well, thanks to ckamin I'm writing this from Knoppix and Konqueror. Seems like "knoppix dma" did the trick. :)

[justThisGuy]

Better yet I can burn a disk with the Benq under windows that scans fine, boots fine in another DVD drive and the Benq still can't boot off it....
At what speed do you burn these discs?

12x on both 16x DVD -R and +R since the drive has some trouble at 16x (see the http://club.cdfreaks.com/forumdisplay.php?f=92 forum). BTW - That forum has some other examples of people having problems:

http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?t=149095

etc

[Harry Kuhman]

12x on both 16x DVD -R and +R since the drive has some trouble at 16x
if the dma switch doesn't resolve all problems for you, I would drop down to a slow speed burn (even 2 or 2.4x) . We see a lot of problems, including burns that seem to work but boot slower that expected on high speed CD burns, and I know my Benq drive doesn't burn DVDs well at high speeds, no matter what it and the media are rated.

[dubbz]

Be careful when burning DVD-R media at 2.4x. I did that with my BENQ drive and got a lot of PI errors in Nero's Disc Quality Test. Burning at 4x actually had much better results (which I did the last time I tried).

(This seems to be a problem with DVD-R, not DVD+R)

[ckamin]

Be careful when burning DVD-R media at 2.4x. I did that with my BENQ drive and got a lot of PI errors in Nero's Disc Quality Test. Burning at 4x actually had much better results (which I did the last time I tried).

(This seems to be a problem with DVD-R, not DVD+R)
I still believe that there are some firmware issues with these drives. Be sure to update to the latest from the drive manufacturer. The issue of SLOW burning speed is one I can't stress enough. It has everything to do with the accuracy of the completed disc. It may very well be that these drives may not burn certain brands/types of media well at one particular speed or the other. The fact that you stated you had issues with DVD-R at 2.4X leads me to believe something is very wrong. 2.4X is a speed that is basically used with DVD+R media only. If it is an issue burning DVD-R at 2.4X, I would have to agree that it may not work well. I use 2X on DVD-R mostly, but usually not over 4X for any DVD I burn, for ANY format. I hold CD-R to 8X or less, as settings permit. I have posted elsewhere about the mechanics of slow burning, but suffice it to say it is highly recommended. If you are burning at 12X or 16X and not having problems, it is probably just a matter of time until you do. It has been well documented, and my personal experience, that burning any disc at slower speeds enhances the compatibility with more drives and the accuracy of the disc. It is amazing how someone will wait HOURS for a DVD iso to download, but will not be patient enough to let it burn to disc for a few extra minutes.

I'm glad that the DMA cheatcode worked out. DMA is the only thing that I can recall causing symptoms such as those described in this thread. I believe that DMA is turned off by default on the newer versions of Knoppix and may be enabled on some other Live versions of Linux. It would be interesting to know if it worked for the others that were having this concern also. Thank you dubbz for posting your success.

[onesandzeros]

Has anyone tried to enable DMA? Cheatcode is "Knoppix dma".

Yep, starting up with "knoppix dma screen=1280x1024 depth=24" does it for me using a benq 1640 (I don't know the firmware version, sorry). I was experiencing the cloop.ko error on a 4.0.2 dvd burned at 8x with the same benq drive, downloaded using bt.

I want to add that using this drive, I also could not boot 3.8.2 and 3.9 cds burned with a different burner (a 52x benq cdrw). However, my previous dvdrom drive, a Liteon 163 I think, could boot both of those without any trouble.

So, for whatever reason, enabling DMA is the way to go.

By the way, thanks to the Knoppix people for all their work. The 4.0.2 dvd's software complement looks... thorough, heh.

Chris

[ckamin]

Yep, starting up with "knoppix dma screen=1280x1024 depth=24" does it for me using a benq 1640
Thanks for the feedback! It appears that these two drives are affected adversely by disabling DMA in the later versions of Knoppix. I'm not exactly sure when DMA was disabled, but I think it was around Version 3.7. That would explain your issues with 3.8.2 and 3.9 previously. The vast majority of the drives in use today do not appear to have these same type of issues. I guess we now know what to do if one comes along.


By the way, thanks to the Knoppix people for all their work. The 4.0.2 dvd's software complement looks... thorough, heh.
I will say that it appears to be an exceptional update. There is enough there to keep me exploring it for some time to come. I just hope that one day I would know what most of it is AND does! The best part is, it appears to work rather well for what I have tried so far. No troubles, no errors, no worries. Just great stuff! ( AND no "Monopoly" to deal with or support!)