Cannot connect to internet through Lan..

[geokok]

Hi....i am a newbie in linux. I wouldn't be one but every time i tried to install or run a live cd somethings just wouldn't work...well please don't let this be one of those times again.
I have the latest version of knoppix (4.02 I think).
As usual the problem is:
1. No internet


I have been trying for some time now to fix them but i had no luck so far. I ll provide some details here, hoping that u can help me become a linux user as well.....Please FEEL FREE to ask any additional information u might need...ANYTHING at all...

1. Internet
I am connected to the internet through my university's lan network. In windows all I had to do was go to another (already connected pc), register my mac address, change my computer's name and workgroup, plug the lan cable on the wall and that was all......
However in knoppix although in the initial loading (text) screen I see that it says "network card found eth0. Broadcast (backgrounding)" I can not connect to the internet. Using network card configuration from the GUI, if I say "yes" when it asks about dhcp (the very first question) it ALWAYS says failed after a while. I did try to set up manually based on settings taken from windows "ipconfig/all" and although i tried many things (not sure they were the right ones though) I still couldn't connect. Just to be sure the card was indeed found I tried to set up a dsl connection (I dont have one, I did it just to see what it would say) I got the message that my device was the eth0. Also I could get feedback from ifconfig list eth0 (not sure about the command now...).


My hardware:
I use a Clevo laptop which is quite new model. P2.0 mobile cpu, ati x700 intel wireless, card reader, bluetooth, pcmcia input, Irda. For the network adapter I know it's a Marvell Yukon someting and for the sound all i know is that is realtech (hd I believe....)

Note: Knoppix will boot only with "nopcmcia" parameter
Note 2: In windows ipconfig/all it says : dhcp activated: YES
.................................................. ........Automatic setup activated: YES

[Harry Kuhman]

http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=16574

[geokok]

I guess I have to apologize...I just got carried away and wanted everything solved...Anyway my main concern is the internet so I ll modify my post and ask for the sound somewhere else....Again sorry,,,,I hope it's ok now..

[Harry Kuhman]

...Anyway my main concern is the internet so I ll modify my post and ask for the sound somewhere else...
Yes, edit your post; change the subject line to something useful.

No, don't ask "somewhere else"; this is the right forum; but as I tried to make clear the issue is using a subject line that is completely useless, not where you posted. When I started complaining about this peopole would respond with the flawed logic "everyone else does it", so now I make it a point of responding with this link whenever I see a generic uninformative subject line.

[geokok]

This is the fourth distribution I have tried the last weeks and this will be the fourth community forum from which I won't be getting ANY answer at all.
I was under the impression that linux communities are very supportive. Furthermore problems like mine that seem huge to me aren't like "a piece of cake" for regular users like yourselves??
Well I guess it is not fair to complain for this forum yet since my message has been posted only for a short period of time....
But I am afraid that the same pattern with other forums will repeat here as well... If u dont get an answer soon u dont get an answer at all.
I am not trying to pull off any tricks or make an impression here....just saying what I ve seen so far...

[Harry Kuhman]

This is the fourth distribution I have tried the last weeks and this will be the fourth community forum from which I won't be getting ANY answer at all.r...
Well, if all your past posts in the other forums used uninformative subject lines like you first used here, that's not unusual. Now that you have started using subject lines that actually give an idea of what you are posting about that may change.


In windows all I had to do was go to another (already connected pc), register my mac address, change my computer's name and workgroup, plug the lan cable on the wall and that was all......

when it asks about dhcp (the very first question) it ALWAYS says failed after a while. I did try to set up manually based on settings taken from windows "ipconfig/all" and although i tried many things (not sure they were the right ones though) I still couldn't connect.
It's not clear (at least to me) what type of system you are connecting to that you would do the setup steps for. So you might want to ask the network people that run your network if they have any help to offer for running Linux, they very likely will be able to give you good answers quickly.

Normally Knoppix will get it's setup by DHCP. If DHCP is not working for you, you likely can plug in the configuration information by running natcardconfig from a shell and answering the DHCP question NO. Then it will ask for all of the information that you have from the windows ipconfig. By the way, the Linux version of ipconfig is ifconfig, which you can use to see how you are set up in Linux. And see man ifconfig and man netcardconfig for more details.

[geokok]

Well to give u an idea I am living in accomodation provided by the university. They offer internet to every room for every student through lan. It is their official position "to support only windows. Mac and linux may require adjustments from you...." even though they use a novell server to run their clusters......
Anyway I have already tried "no" to dhcp and i did try to set it manually but somehow i just cant get it to work,,,,maybe i am putting something the wrong way......For example, I get pretty much everything that is needed from ipconfig/all but I don't get a broadcast address...I tried various things but no luck so far.......Is there anything from my settings I could tell u that might help to break through this????I am really becoming desparate here...I try to use as much open source as possible and I cant run linux (I ve been trying for years BUT i never had the "proper" hardware....).

[Harry Kuhman]

... It is their official position "to support only windows. Mac and linux may require adjustments from you...."


Anyway I have already tried "no" to dhcp and i did try to set it manually but ....
While I do understand that they can't hand-hold everyone with every different OS they can come up with, I would think that it is extremely likely that someone on the support staff could answer a few questions for you and has likely seen this many times before. And, given that one way or another you are the one paying for this I don't think it's unreasonable that you shoud expect some answers; it's much more unreasonable that they would have a system that can easily be used by only Microsoft customers.

However, I would also suggest that you post what settings you are seeing on a windows system and what settings you are putting into netcardconfig. It's very likely that if this is a settings issue someone here will spot the setting that needs to be changed for you. Without that information I don't see what you could expect us to do.

I have also seen one unusual report of a MAC address that changed between Windows and Linux! This is certainly not the normal case; it never has happened on any of my systems and I don't expect it is happening on your system either. But I believe the report and it never was posted back what was causing it, so there is a chance (although very very small) that since your system needs a MAC address it could be seeing a different one when you boot Linux than when you boot Windows. Just something to keep an eye out for.

[geokok]

I deleted the ip settings cause the problem is obviously on the card.

[geokok]

Ok I have the REASON for the problem!!!!
With netconfig -a in knoppix the results that came back were a big surprise!!!
The mac-address (which my guess is that it is the same thing as HWaddress right??) was the same.......with the mac- address of my laptop's wireless card!!!!
I tried to switch off wirelless before knoppix would load (from the switch on the laptop) but then the mac-address was full of zeros.....
So the ONLY device seen as eth0 by knoppix is my wireless card????
What am I supposed to do now???This is getting to deep for my skills.......
I thought that ethernet connections were standard for linux and that wirelless was always the problem...and I get the other way around....Does tux has something personal with me?????

[OErjan]

hmm, what does lspci say?
that should give info on the networking hardware you have.

[geokok]

Ok here is the feedback from lspci:

Ethernet controller : Marvell Technology Group Ltd: Unknown device 4362 (rev 15)

Network Controller: Intel PRO/Wirelless 2200BG (rev 05)

I also get this (this has nothing to do with network but since I found it....):
Intel Corp 82801FB/FBM/FR/FW/FRW (ICH6 family) high definition audio controller (rev 04)...........Why the hell I got no sound then???

[OErjan]

sound part may be as simpel as opening a mixer and seting the soundlevels. try aumix, kmix...
if that fails try running alsaconf by typing
sudo alsaconf then you just read and do what the program tell you (90% of the time just klicking next).
as for the ethernet, eeh, uncomon is to be mild, I have rarely had a Linux computer refuse a regular card.
hmm, is that a gigabit card?
if so perhaps here is the solution
http://www.syskonnect.de/syskonnect/support/driver/readme/linux/sk98lin.html.
if i read that right it is integrated in the most recent kernels, mine is 2.6.14and i have it. try
sudo modprobe sk98lin the kernel MAY have a driver too old for your card though. if this had been a installed linux it would have been an easy fx but from CD or DVD... not as easy.

[geokok]

Ok I checked ypur link and I have to say this.....
ARE YOU KIDDING ME ???
How am I supposed to do all that stuff???
The reason I chose knoppix is because it is supposed to be easy (considering there is no install) for a windows user to see how linux works!!!
To do all that I need 2 Msc in computer engineering 1 phD in programming and some part time studying in psychology!!!!!!!!!!
There has to be an easier way to make this work!!!\
I mean I am dying to use linux and I ll have to give up trying if that's the only way. Imagine how much sooner a guy who just wants to "check it out" would give up!!!!
People lets be realistic!!!It's 2005!!!! Things cant be THAT complicated!!!!

As for the kernel it's the latest knoppix I could get a week ago from this site.....don';t know what drivers it packs..

[OErjan]

as I said. it actually IS easy, it was the modprobe part that was the solution, you should already HAVE the driver on your disk.
did you even try the modprobe comand?
sudo alsaconf
if that did not work, :oops: eeh, it means you sadly have a kernel that has a driver too old for your network card, you have to remember things are slightly lagging in linux drivers.
it is likely fixed in near future though.
WHYT? well, the drivers (modules actually) have to be made from ground up without the manufacturers helping out at all, not an easy task.
if the manufacturers helped the linux comunity 1% as much as they help microsoft, things would be greatly different, just alowing us to get bare minimum of info would make it MUCH easyer, as things stand we have to more or less make educated guesses.
Nvidia has gone part of the way and made a Linux installer so has ATI.
Several other manufacturers have caught on, we are not holding our breaths though.
sorry.

by the way, likely you could make it work in a actuall installed system by simply upgrading your kernel. or even module alone. not a klick and it is finished solution, but one that very few actually have to take out of necesity, many do it just to get the most out of their sustems though.

[Markus]

Don't know if this driver comes with knoppix, but you might want to try:
rmmod sk98lin
modprobe skge

[geokok]

So basically what I have to do is wait for the next version of knoppix that "might" have the drivers??
Anyway even if it sounds bizzare to u i do understand that these problems are caused by the lack of support from manufacturers.
Now i will try the mod thing u suggested . Since u mentioned the kernel thing though I want to ask u this as well. Through some gui command (I think it is configure sound--> it pops a window with options..) I get this error message that my kernel does not support the drivers and i should use kernel newer than 2.2??????What is that? I mean the kernel is like 2.6 or something!!!!!
Oh I have so many problems, I dont know anything and no one around here runs linux......I dont know what to do....
So to summarize: I try the modprobe, pray and wait...........
When do u think my hardware will be supported?
Any other distros (live only please) I could try??
I already tried slax (doesn't load because of some stupid vesa error) and ubuntu live (crashes during loading at the hotplug detection point...).

By the way u might be interested in hearing the following: In knoppel (greek version of knoppix ) which is based on an older version of knoppix (if I am wrong it is same as current knoppix at most) my vga is recognized as ati x700. However knoppix fails to recognize it at all......how about that?

[geokok]

Ok people final results.....
I did get sound. It seems kmix was the thing with some other adjustments that specified the input for my mic (front, rear) that obviously confused knoppix.
The modprobe commands failed to find the module and the dmesg command clearly showed the wirelless but no sign of my ethernet card......
So I guess no internet for me...
By the way I am experiencing one more problem that no other disrto gave me. When I plug my usb stick nothing happens....

[OErjan]

as to how long for new driver, no idea, i am no developer.
sorry to hear that,hmm, thast usbstick SHOULD be recognized. what does dmesg say if you plug it in AFTER boot?
should be something about USB and mass storage.

[geokok]

on dmseg everything seems to be there about usb and mass storage and everything.
With knoppel the stick is found immidiatelly (but on knoppel i have no sound...older kernell i think).

[rusty]

Hi,

Could you post the output from: lsmod.

Just to see what modules are loaded.

[geokok]

actually i cannot because i can only connect to the internet through windows and I cannot use my usb stick to save the file to post it here. If u know another way...

[OErjan]

do you have a floppydrive?
in that case, incert a floppy klick the floppy icon (that mounts it)
type
lsmod>/mnt/floppy/lsmod.txt
rightclick the icon and select unmount, now you have the text output of lsmod on your floppy.

[geokok]

no floppy...sorry....

[OErjan]

hmm, ok, do you see any of these in your output?
ehci
uhci
ohci
the comand dmesg saying anything on mass storage after you plug the pen in (not plugged in while booting)?

[rusty]

open a terminal (shell) and type:sudo modconf

You will be able to scroll down through t he kernel modules . when you get to one of interest you can hit enter to see if it's installed

see if kernel/driver/net/sk98lin has a plus sign or not
see if kernel/drivers/usb/storage has + sign

the only other distro that might work that i can think of is kanotix but with two network interfaces your going to have to play with things. I'm surprised ubuntu didn't work. Can you remove / disable the wireless ( or get a wireless router :) )

[geokok]

Ok i did what you told me....here are the results.

lsmod (with and without the usb stick it was the same):
usb storage -->0
ohci_hcd-->0
uhci_hcd-->0
usbcore--> 5 usbhid, usb storage, ohci_hcd, uhci_hcd

I also found this : sk98lin-->0 (is this the driver for my net card??????)
.................................................. .................................................. ....
dmseg: Usb mass storage support registered
.................................................. .................................................. ...
Finally i did this...
sudo modconf:
I found sk98lin + and usb/storage +...... I unloaded both (closed the wirelless from the case button) reloaded them and what a surprize.....nothing.....
.................................................. .................................................. ...

[rusty]

the presence of the sk98lin module suggests that the wired interface is having drivers loaded.

If you can disable the wireless before booting knoppix, get it out of the hardware picture, that would be worthwhile. You may have already tried that?

The other thing to do is to try and bring the wired interface up. From a shell type ifconfig and not the output. With the wireless enabled you would see entries for it (eth0) and the pc itself (lo).

Now type : sudo ifup eth1, and then ifconfig again to see if anything has changed. You can type : man ifup for info on that command.

BTW what happens if you boot without the nopcmcia option?

[geokok]

Ok i already have tried to boot with wireless disabled (through the switch on the laptop case) and what i got as a result (i dont remember at all the command i think it was ls something...anyway it ended with eth0...) was all zeros (00:00......etc..) for HWaddress (this is the mac right??).

If I boot without the nopcmcia I simply never boot...it stucks where it scans for pcmcia.

So, to see if I got u right u want me to go to a terminal and type sudo ifup eth1 and then ifconfig...I ll get back to u..

By the way..worst case scenario...if we dont make it (most likely) how long (more or less) would i have to wait for my laptop to become "mature" enough for linux...?

[rusty]

Basically what i'm guessing is that with both interfaces , knoppix for some reason defaults to the wireless one and brings it up as eth0. The ifup scheme is just to see whether the wired interface can be brought into operation as eth1, then made to work.

If you can disable the wireless before boot and you're getting eth0 messages then we should explore that more. Its possible that knoppix sees your wired interface as eth0 and it just needs to be configured. With wireless disabled do you see a entry for eth0 when you run ifconfig?


By the way..worst case scenario...if we dont make it (most likely) how long (more or less) would i have to wait for my laptop to become "mature" enough for linux...?

It can probably be made to work, now, just need to find the right combination of things. As new versions of knoppix, kanotix , mepis and ubuntu are released you might find one that works "out of the box".