Help and Configuration for v6.2

[HelpPleas]

Apologies if this info has been posted elsewhere – I searched but couldn't find it.
I'm a former user of Knoppix v5.1.1 and v5.3.1, I've been forced onto v6.2 because older versions won't boot on my new PC.
There are a number of things I don't much like about this new version, and I'm wondering if I can configure them back to the way I prefer.

Rapid movement of mouse across Desktop can cause a set of small windows to appear – it looks like some kind of alternate Desktop feature, can I suppress this feature?

Slow Window Closing - a fancy feature where the window breaks up into fragments before disappearing. Sorry, but it's just annoying when I'm in a hurry.

No Partition Icons on Desktop. I found the icons when I opened PCMan File Manager, but the partitions then mounted in read-write mode, which I don't necessarily want. In v5 I could click the desktop icons to get read-only access, or click Home button on Taskbar followed by Go > Storage Media to open partitions for writing to.

There seems to be no General Help, I can only find help for individual apps.

Sorry if I sound a bit grumpy, there are some things I like as well :)

[krishna.murphy]

Apologies if this info has been posted elsewhere – I searched but couldn't find it.
I'm a former user of Knoppix v5.1.1 and v5.3.1, I've been forced onto v6.2 because older versions won't boot on my new PC.
There are a number of things I don't much like about this new version, and I'm wondering if I can configure them back to the way I prefer.

Rapid movement of mouse across Desktop can cause a set of small windows to appear – it looks like some kind of alternate Desktop feature, can I suppress this feature?

Slow Window Closing - a fancy feature where the window breaks up into fragments before disappearing. Sorry, but it's just annoying when I'm in a hurry.

No Partition Icons on Desktop. I found the icons when I opened PCMan File Manager, but the partitions then mounted in read-write mode, which I don't necessarily want. In v5 I could click the desktop icons to get read-only access, or click Home button on Taskbar followed by Go > Storage Media to open partitions for writing to.

There seems to be no General Help, I can only find help for individual apps.

Sorry if I sound a bit grumpy, there are some things I like as well :)

1) I'd like to be able to suppress "mouse gesturing" too, but have found that I can at least repeat the gesture (fast up-left or fast up-right to the respective corners) when it happens, or click (or double-click) on one the "new windows" to cancel/switch to one of them.

2) Use the cheat-code command "knoppix no3d" at boot to stop the fancy Compiz features like "exploding windows."

3) Partitions seem to be automagically mounted read-write on bootup these days, even NTFS (which I've heard is "dangerous", though the worst it seems to do in my case is start sucking enormous amounts of system resources, forcing a power-off reboot.)

4) General help seems to be here, rather than on the CD.

Hope this helps! :)
Krishna

[HelpPleas]

Thanks for replying, Krishna.

I've been trying different cheatcodes to configure desktop behaviour, but I'm very unhappy about the inability to leave drives unmounted, or to mount them read-only.

I've decided to raise a separate thread on that subject, because it seems to me to be crucial - Knoppix used to be a brilliant Live CD, and now I'm not sure it's even safe to use.

[Capricorny]

Thanks for replying, Krishna.

I've been trying different cheatcodes to configure desktop behaviour, but I'm very unhappy about the inability to leave drives unmounted, or to mount them read-only.

I've decided to raise a separate thread on that subject, because it seems to me to be crucial - Knoppix used to be a brilliant Live CD, and now I'm not sure it's even safe to use.

There must be something seriously wrong with your setup. To monitor the system state, df is one of my most used commands, and it tells you about mounted volumes and free space.
I have never experienced any og the 6.X versions do any auto-mounting outside /mnt-system and loop-mounting og KNOPPIX stuff. That would have been completely unacceptable.

But if you are using PCman, lots of things may happen. Not entirely by itself, it seems, but when you start to explore volumes..

And, in any case, you are NEVER unable to do ro-mounting. You just have to make sure device is not busy, and issue sudo umount /media/sda2 (or whatever), and then sudo mount -o ro /dev/sda2 /media/sda2.

[HelpPleas]

OK, some confusion here.

I started using desktop=gnome because I really didn't like the standard desktop. When you boot with gnome desktop, every available partition is mounted read-write. Maybe that's a bug.

It turns out that this is not the case when you use the default desktop. By default, they are not mounted, but if you mount them in PCMan File Manager, they are mounted RW.

So, clearly I must avoid the gnome desktop and try to live with the default one.

But I would still like to know how to mount a drive read-only via the GUI - I don't really trust myself when it comes to using commands (I've been spoiled, you would probably say).

[krishna.murphy]

Thanks for replying, Krishna.

I've been trying different cheatcodes to configure desktop behaviour, but I'm very unhappy about the inability to leave drives unmounted, or to mount them read-only.

I've decided to raise a separate thread on that subject, because it seems to me to be crucial - Knoppix used to be a brilliant Live CD, and now I'm not sure it's even safe to use.

There must be something seriously wrong with your setup. To monitor the system state, df is one of my most used commands, and it tells you about mounted volumes and free space.
I have never experienced any og the 6.X versions do any auto-mounting outside /mnt-system and loop-mounting og KNOPPIX stuff. That would have been completely unacceptable.

But if you are using PCman, lots of things may happen. Not entirely by itself, it seems, but when you start to explore volumes..

And, in any case, you are NEVER unable to do ro-mounting. You just have to make sure device is not busy, and issue sudo umount /media/sda2 (or whatever), and then sudo mount -o ro /dev/sda2 /media/sda2.

Hmm-

I'm comparing my setup, which has a NTFS partition auto-mounted RW on sda1; here's a df and a mount immediately after booting with a knoppix fromhd=/dev/sda1, which may be forcing the mount...

Here's a screenshot (https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0Bwylelj8GMc4ZTA1MDcwMmEtOTA3OC00MjhhLWJkM jUtZGE5NjBiZjI0NmM1&hl=en) and the copied text below, which looks funny in proportionally spaced font:

knoppix@Microknoppix:~$ df
Filesystem 1K-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on
/dev/sda1 70971068 54584672 16386396 77% /mnt-system
tmpfs 1048576 0 1048576 0% /ramdisk
/dev/cloop 8609566 8609566 0 100% /KNOPPIX
/dev/loop0 2015824 1912964 102860 95% /KNOPPIX-DATA
unionfs 2015824 1912964 102860 95% /UNIONFS
unionfs 2015824 1912964 102860 95% /home
tmpfs 10240 60 10180 1% /UNIONFS/var/run
tmpfs 10240 0 10240 0% /UNIONFS/var/lock
tmpfs 102400 60 102340 1% /UNIONFS/var/log
tmpfs 1048576 8 1048568 1% /tmp
udev 20480 304 20176 2% /dev
tmpfs 1048576 1488 1047088 1% /dev/shm
knoppix@Microknoppix:~$ mount
rootfs on / type rootfs (rw,relatime)
proc on /proc type proc (rw,relatime)
sysfs on /sys type sysfs (rw,relatime)
/dev/sda1 on /mnt-system type fuseblk (rw,relatime,user_id=0,group_id=0,allow_other,blks ize=4096)
tmpfs on /ramdisk type tmpfs (rw,relatime,size=1048576k)
/dev/cloop on /KNOPPIX type iso9660 (ro,relatime)
/dev/loop0 on /KNOPPIX-DATA type ext2 (rw,relatime,errors=continue)
unionfs on /UNIONFS type aufs (rw,relatime,si=9b00fa52,noplink)
unionfs on /home type aufs (rw,relatime,si=9b00fa52,noplink)
usbfs on /proc/bus/usb type usbfs (rw,relatime)
tmpfs on /UNIONFS/var/run type tmpfs (rw,relatime,size=10240k)
tmpfs on /UNIONFS/var/lock type tmpfs (rw,relatime,size=10240k)
tmpfs on /UNIONFS/var/log type tmpfs (rw,relatime,size=102400k)
tmpfs on /tmp type tmpfs (rw,relatime,size=1048576k)
udev on /dev type tmpfs (rw,relatime,size=20480k)
tmpfs on /dev/shm type tmpfs (rw,relatime,size=1048576k)
devpts on /dev/pts type devpts (rw,relatime,mode=1777)

[garaden]

Krishna, that /dev/sda1 mount's probably from the cheat code, not from the OS. The device containing the Knoppix files (either the Live CD or the fromhd= device) is always mounted at /mnt-system as far as I can tell (apparently that directory used to be called /cd-rom before USB and HDD boots became common). That is, if you're able to mount it at all >_< (see my own thread of distress! (http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30541))

That said, I don't know enough about GNOME to figure out why it's mounting everything at startup (sounds like a "just works"/windows copycat feature), but if you want tight control over filesystems I feel like the command line's the best way to do it, HelpPleas. I know that's kind of a cop-out since GUI functionality existed in the past, but honestly I prefer the command line myself for delicate work. It's less intuitive than the GUI but once you get used to it the extra control is well worth it, especially for things like this where the default GUI behavior is not what you want. Once you know what you want better than the GUI does, it's definitely time to "trust yourself" :)

[Capricorny]

Krishna, that /dev/sda1 mount's probably from the cheat code, not from the OS. The device containing the Knoppix files (either the Live CD or the fromhd= device) is always mounted at /mnt-system as far as I can tell (apparently that directory used to be called /cd-rom before USB and HDD boots became common). That is, if you're able to mount it at all >_< (see my own thread of distress! (http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30541))

That said, I don't know enough about GNOME to figure out why it's mounting everything at startup (sounds like a "just works"/windows copycat feature), but if you want tight control over filesystems I feel like the command line's the best way to do it, HelpPleas. I know that's kind of a cop-out since GUI functionality existed in the past, but honestly I prefer the command line myself for delicate work. It's less intuitive than the GUI but once you get used to it the extra control is well worth it, especially for things like this where the default GUI behavior is not what you want. Once you know what you want better than the GUI does, it's definitely time to "trust yourself" :)

I completely agree. And I think we have at least two serious bugs from this thread, if reports are correct:

1. Auto-mounting rw (PCman/GNOME)
2. Mounting NTFS rw without grand warnings - even if it is just to rw-access the persistent image.

I think both should be fixed. RO-mounting is an entirely different issue - doing that automatically is fine with me, even though I prefer a somewhat more lazy system. PCman could be set up with reasonable defaults, I think.

[HelpPleas]

Thanks for your comments, everyone.

How do you report bugs in Knoppix?

And how soon are they normally fixed?

For the time being, I am going to use the default desktop (with the no3d cheatcode), and get used to using the mount command.

I found Konqueror in the Internet submenu, so I will be using that to browse my files (Settings > Show Navigation Panel). It doesn't mount partitions, the only problem is that you might think you're looking at an empty partition when actually it's unmounted.

[klaus2008]

How do you report bugs in Knoppix?

You may send a message to Klaus Knopper. There is a special web page http://www.knopper.net/kontakt/index-en.php. But he seems to be very busy.

[krishna.murphy]

I agree, re: the cause of the mount; in fact I mentioned that as the probable cause.

I disagree, re: automounting without warning. I've made extensive use of the r/w auto-mounted NTFS drive with only minor problems, and never any data loss not caused by me. The worst problem I had is when usage went beyond a certain threshold, it maxed out processor usage and sometimes forced me to shut it down with the power switch "Grand warnings" would frighten people for no good reason IMHO.



Krishna, that /dev/sda1 mount's probably from the cheat code, not from the OS. The device containing the Knoppix files (either the Live CD or the fromhd= device) is always mounted at /mnt-system as far as I can tell (apparently that directory used to be called /cd-rom before USB and HDD boots became common). That is, if you're able to mount it at all >_< (see my own thread of distress! (http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30541))

That said, I don't know enough about GNOME to figure out why it's mounting everything at startup (sounds like a "just works"/windows copycat feature), but if you want tight control over filesystems I feel like the command line's the best way to do it, HelpPleas. I know that's kind of a cop-out since GUI functionality existed in the past, but honestly I prefer the command line myself for delicate work. It's less intuitive than the GUI but once you get used to it the extra control is well worth it, especially for things like this where the default GUI behavior is not what you want. Once you know what you want better than the GUI does, it's definitely time to "trust yourself" :)

I completely agree. And I think we have at least two serious bugs from this thread, if reports are correct:

1. Auto-mounting rw (PCman/GNOME)
2. Mounting NTFS rw without grand warnings - even if it is just to rw-access the persistent image.

I think both should be fixed. RO-mounting is an entirely different issue - doing that automatically is fine with me, even though I prefer a somewhat more lazy system. PCman could be set up with reasonable defaults, I think.

[Capricorny]

....
I disagree, re: automounting without warning. I've made extensive use of the r/w auto-mounted NTFS drive with only minor problems, and never any data loss not caused by me. The worst problem I had is when usage went beyond a certain threshold, it maxed out processor usage and sometimes forced me to shut it down with the power switch "Grand warnings" would frighten people for no good reason IMHO.
....

OK, this was Windows... NT4,2000,XP,Vista,7? It's all 'NTFS', and I don't know if that example you give is not something that should warrant a warning. But 'grand', that may be a bit too much - at least if most users have experiences similar to yours. I just wonder why it is not more broadly recommended if it is as safe as you experience?

[krishna.murphy]

....
I disagree, re: automounting without warning. I've made extensive use of the r/w auto-mounted NTFS drive with only minor problems, and never any data loss not caused by me. The worst problem I had is when usage went beyond a certain threshold, it maxed out processor usage and sometimes forced me to shut it down with the power switch "Grand warnings" would frighten people for no good reason IMHO.
....

OK, this was Windows... NT4,2000,XP,Vista,7? It's all 'NTFS', and I don't know if that example you give is not something that should warrant a warning. But 'grand', that may be a bit too much - at least if most users have experiences similar to yours. I just wonder why it is not more broadly recommended if it is as safe as you experience?

It's XP SP3, when it's not knoppix. Not sure, but it might be due to OLD problems, or maybe the problems I experienced would have been worse for others.

[Capricorny]

I have just looked a little bit around, and it seems that using ntfs-3g for writing may now be considered acceptably safe. I don't think the Open SUSE wiki entry, http://en.opensuse.org/NTFS , which has been recently edited and reviewed, would have recommended it , also for ordinary users, otherwise. SUSE is much focused on interoperability. But they advise against mounting damaged systems rw.

From the descriptions of NTFS 3.1, it seems that changes with new OS versions mostly have to do with metadata use, so while writing may imply a risk of getting impaired functionality in some respects, the likelihood of messing up the whole file system is much less. And, in particular, when using NTFS only for the KNOPPIX structure with the persistent image, almost all updating happens inside that file - which ought to minimize the risk of file system damage. So, at least, "installing" the Knoppix files on NTFS seem to be relatively safe. A small warning would still be in place at such "installs", as it is not foolproof, but I think I agree with your considerations :)

Edit: Fixed link, it should work now.

[krishna.murphy]

I have just looked a little bit around, and it seems that using ntfs-3g for writing may now be considered acceptably safe. I don't think the Open SUSE wiki entry, http://en.opensuse.org/NTFS, which has been recently edited and reviewed, would have recommended it , also for ordinary users, otherwise. SUSE is much focused on interoperability. But they advise against mounting damaged systems rw.

From the descriptions of NTFS 3.1, it seems that changes with new OS versions mostly have to do with metadata use, so while writing may imply a risk of getting impaired functionality in some respects, the likelihood of messing up the whole file system is much less. And, in particular, when using NTFS only for the KNOPPIX structure with the persistent image, almost all updating happens inside that file - which ought to minimize the risk of file system damage. So, at least, "installing" the Knoppix files on NTFS seem to be relatively safe. A small warning would still be in place at such "installs", as it is not foolproof, but I think I agree with your considerations :)I

Okay, cool. I appreciate the research you did and the time you give. FYI, in my experience it's confusing for newb-z if you send a link like that; the comma at the end caused a "page not found" error when I clicked it. No problem for me, of course, but others may see it and get frustrated when it doesn't "just work."