knoppix 6.2 en - open office not working

[ialtaparmakov]

hi
i have knoppix 6.2 hd install and i updated it by apt-get update and by update manager - did i do something wrong by update?

then
i found that open office in knoppix 6.2 is not working - it showed some German message that and asking me to install open office again

so

i tried to copy files from knoppix 6.2.1 but surprise knoppix 6.2.1 dvd was unable to mount any file system- neither raiserfs nor ntfs -so wonderful !!! is it only to me that every next version of knoppix is worst then previous?

so i tried to update open office but was unable - too many dependencies , i uninstalled the office and tried to install it again
from deb packages - i was unable - too many dependencies

then i tried to install it from rpm - but some error occurred... so i have no office now i have no way to uninstall and no way to install

what to do now?

i wanted to update hd install form knoppix 6.2.1 but oopsss - no way ... why so ?

it seems that linux is so user unfriendly.... and community says that i have to stay away from hd install ...


p.s.
please don't tell me to stay away from hd install - this does not work - it is equal to say me to stay away from linux at all

thanks (unfortunately for now there is headache to thank for)

best regards

[Harry Kuhman]

...please don't tell me to stay away from hd install - this does not work - it is equal to say me to stay away from linux at all ...
There is a special version of Knoppix just made for hard disk install. It is called "Debian". Install that and you will avoid all of the known problems that are seen when "installing" the Knoppix CD or DVD that are intended to be live CD/DVDs.

I can assure you that avoiding installing the Live disc does work, I've avoided doing it for years.

[Capricorny]

hi
i have knoppix 6.2 hd install and i updated it by apt-get update and by update manager - did i do something wrong by update?

then
i found that open office in knoppix 6.2 is not working - it showed some German message that and asking me to install open office again

so

i tried to copy files from knoppix 6.2.1 but surprise knoppix 6.2.1 dvd was unable to mount any file system- neither raiserfs nor ntfs -so wonderful !!! is it only to me that every next version of knoppix is worst then previous?

so i tried to update open office but was unable - too many dependencies , i uninstalled the office and tried to install it again
from deb packages - i was unable - too many dependencies

then i tried to install it from rpm - but some error occurred... so i have no office now i have no way to uninstall and no way to install

what to do now?

i wanted to update hd install form knoppix 6.2.1 but oopsss - no way ... why so ?

it seems that linux is so user unfriendly.... and community says that i have to stay away from hd install ...


p.s.
please don't tell me to stay away from hd install - this does not work - it is equal to say me to stay away from linux at all

thanks (unfortunately for now there is headache to thank for)

best regards
First, I can't understand why you HAVE to do normal HD installs with Knoppix. I'm running it from a HD, booting with GRUB, I think no users would fell any difference. But there is a hell of a lot of difference with upgrading!!!! There has to be something you have missed, I think.
Second: Staying away from Knoppix HD installs means you have to stay away from Linux at all? Which planet do you live on? Almost ANY Linux distro is better than Knoppix for permanent, "normal" HD installs. I can't really believe you have tried them all and failed, and Knoppix was the only one you could get to work.

[ialtaparmakov]

There is a special version of Knoppix just made for hard disk install. It is called "Debian". Install that and you will avoid all of the known problems that are seen when "installing" the Knoppix CD or DVD that are intended to be live CD/DVDs.

I can assure you that avoiding installing the Live disc does work, I've avoided doing it for years.

ok
i have heard that there is such special version for hd install , that contains so big bunch of software as knoppix. i thought that this special version - it is knoppix.
i used knoppix for a while from the dvd , but it was too slow (my dvd is rather old , i am afraid that dvd will die very soon : my computer is second hand with used parts ).

so i decided that installing to hd will fasten the work and save for little bit longer time my dvd . i thought that it is not worth to spent time to search and accommodate to other distribution and bunch of installed programs than knoppix. it is better to use something familiar and made especially to have enough programs for , isn't it ?
then i saw "knoppix hd install" and used it i did not know that "knoppix tohd" is different - in fact i thought that i am doing something equal to "knoppix tohd" , then i decided that hd install would be faster than copying knoppix image to hd , because using image would require additional processor time for decompression.
so i thought there is good reason to do hd install . and of course there will be problems , but i thought that community would have a solution. or will find a solution (i thought linux communities work this way). for example i was imagining that someone will answer something like this " there is a script (i wrote) . you should run it form 6.2.1 and it will do what you need. it is still test version and you try it at your risk ... " or " in 6.3.1 we will make script for updating older versions hd installs" . this is the way open source communities work. isn't it ?

i did not expect such radical solution: " do not use !!! " this sounded to me rather like advice " if you have headache - try cut your head "

so what distribution to use ? but distribution with enough installed programs ?
ubuntu live/install dvd seems that lacks many of software that is present in knoppix .
the other distributions i found seems that are small than ubuntu, or not live. so knoppix left as my best choice.

how could i know that it will end this way ? :(

thanks

best regards

[Harry Kuhman]

....so what distribution to use ? but distribution with enough installed programs ? ...
I was, I hoped obviously, kidding a bit by calling Debian a special version of Knoppix intended for HD install. The truth, which should be obvious, is that Debian is the distro that Knoppix is based on and Debian is intended for installing to hard disk. Knoppix is unfortunately a mix of Debian releases that have carefully been tuned to work together from a Live CD, but no effort has been made to get it working properly when "installed" to hard disk, and there are many known problems, particularly if you ever want to add programs, or update anything.

Debian does not install with lots of additional software (although there is some additional stuff, particularly when you do the "desktop install" that most users will opt for). There is no reason that it should. If you have a high speed internet connection, you can easiy install whatever you want with a simple apt-get. For example, if you want to add wireshark, you should be able to install it by just typing "apt-get wireshark". (assuming that your system is current, if not you precede this with "apt-get update".) If you have a high speed connection, I suggest doing a net-install, which needs a minimal size CD and installs most of Debian from the web. If you don't happen to have a high speed connection you might want to have one or more of the Debian install CDs or ever a DVD and install from that. At install time it will scan all of the discs that you have and build a database of what is on the discs, allowing you to install any of the applications by swapping in a disc.

I actually don't want a lot of applications to come in with a default install. I want to pick the applications that I use, there is no reason to bloat your system with unneeded and unused package just because someone else used them or because they were included on a Knoppix disc (I can list plenty of things included on the Knoppix DVD that I would never use and simply should not be on my computer). In some cases this might even be a security issue. For example I'm never going to use IRC, so there in no reason that I should have any IRC software on my system, and IRC has been an attack vector.

My point is that a reasonable Linux user should not want a lot of bloat installed in his system and he can easily install what he does want when he wants it. There are known problems installing Knopix to hard disk, there always have been. Ever the main author of Knoppix does not recommend it and advises against it in most cases. An install script was only included years ago because Debian's installer was mush less user friend and required a great deal of technical knowledge to do an install. People at the time complained "if Knoppix can figure out these things automatically, why can't the Debian installer?" Well, the Debian team listened and improved the Debian installer so you no longer need detailed hardware interrupt and irq information and other data, and installing Debial is generally very clean now. But some people still insist on trying to install Knoppix, even when there is no valid reason to do so for most users and there are known problems.

I suggest installing the unstable or even the testing versions of Debian, doing a net-install if you have high speed access. The "stable" version is also available, but I would only use that in mission critical business server situations, as it is older and may not include a lot of newer software and changes. Don't be fooled by the names, the "unstable" version of Knoppix is quite stable, much more so than anything that Microsoft ha ever released, and is what Knoppix is based on (unfortunately, Knoppix is a mix of unstable, testing and maybe even stable, which causes problems is you ever try to do an update).

So if someone insists on installing Knoppix (usually because it is the only version of Linux that they have used) and it makes it easier for them to do the right thing by calling Debian a special version of Knoppix intended for hard disk install, then I'm willing to give them that comfort by making the comparison. The real truth is that Knoppix is a special version of Debain, but the bottom line is that Knoppix is intended as a Live disc and Debian is intended as an installed Linux distro. And any application that comes with Knoppx, and thousands more, can easily be installed in Debian with a simple apt-get.

[Capricorny]

i did not expect such radical solution: " do not use !!! " this sounded to me rather like advice " if you have headache - try cut your head "

so what distribution to use ? but distribution with enough installed programs ?
ubuntu live/install dvd seems that lacks many of software that is present in knoppix .
the other distributions i found seems that are small than ubuntu, or not live. so knoppix left as my best choice.


Mandriva may be a good choice for you, in case you find standard Debian too user-unfriendly. But Fedora and Suse would also fill your needs, in case you have got something against Ubuntu. For Knoppix useres, Ubuntu is probably the "closest relative" normal distro. And I'm quite sure that there are no important programs available on the Knoppix DVD that are not either present on the Ubuntu equivalent, or can easily be downloaded and installed. You will also very soon discover that the Knoppix selection is by no means "complete", and I don't even think it is very well thought out as a do-all-thing for individual use. It is, rather, optimized to give 90% of all users 90-95%% of the programs they need or wish to use - a very nice all round optimization, but you cannot, in general, depend on the standard selection. Therefore, giving up on Knoppix for normal HD install is in no way to cut off your head. It is rather to stop banging your head against the cement wall, which may in fact be good advice against headache ;).

The selection of programs on the live CDs are, in general, not very indicative of the usefulness of a distro. When you do normal installs, you usually start out with 3-5 CDs or a DVD, and during install you usually have the options to pick whole categories of programs, or simply choose "install everything". Then you will usually get more than you do with any Knoppix version. But, as Harry Kuhman notes, it is seldom in the users' best interest to simply "install everything", and more is definitely not better unless you have well-defined needs for it. Mandriva and Ubuntu, for example, have live CDs that are also designed for normal installation, which Knoppix is not.

[jheaton5]

To the OP: to get a working version of Open Office - open a root terminal and use the following code

# aptitude -t testing install openoffice.org

[johnmd]

Thanks very much for your miracle fix for OpenOffice. I had a different problem with my hd install of 6.2dvd - help didn't work and kept putting up message saying help file wasn't installed - when it actually was (but maybe the wrong version?) so I tried reinstalling Oo hoping to get compatible versions of Oo and openoffice.org-help-en-us - but this left me with no icons and toolbar icon names stretched way off the screen - but your fix with aptitude worked a treat - pity that help file still not accessible but at least I can use Oo again which is the most important thing. Correction - now I've run your aptitude code with openoffice.org-en-us and wow - it works - so now I can get help as well as write stuff - thanks again - a bigger miracle than i thought at first. By the way I should say I've had fewer problems with my Knoppix hd installs than with Mandriva, Ubuntu or Debian, so I don't understand why folk advise so strongly against it - I think it's great as a hd install [Compaq desktop 2003, 512mB Ram AMD Athlon XP 2400 40gB HD]

[PattiMichell]

Does Debian have the hardware-detection and setup capabilities of Knoppix? Knoppix 6.2.1 did an amazing job of finding everything on my laptop.

[krishna.murphy]

Probably a little less, but they've moved in the "Knoppix direction" ever since it became available. YMMV

Cheers!
Krishna :mrgreen: