Seriously Miffed @ KDE!!! PLEASE HELP!!!

[A. Jorge Garcia]

OK, I am REALLY miffed!

I've been using KNOPPIX since V2.2 Final. I've never had a problem like this thru V3.1. I have this problem with every release of V3.2 I've tried (the first one in Jan, the first one in May and 20030606).

I teach C++ and Java to preAP and AP Computer Science students in a High School setting. I've got them pretty comfortable with Linux in general and KNOPPIX in particular as well as using /mnt/floppy to save/load their files. They typically use Konqueror to download assignments from my website, KATE to edit/save/print their code and Konsole to compile and execute. I don't get into EMACS or VI or MAKE or any fancy IDEs. This worked great for us thru V3.1 (we used V3.1 20030101 all last semester without a hitch as a poor man's dual boot).

OK, here's the problem. Ever since V3.2 everything works great except printing files from KATE. Now I don't know if its KATE or the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration for CUPS, but the whole system freezes-up when I print from KATE. I get a message that kate is preparing to print page 1, then NOTHING happens! This happens no mater what printer I use (local, tcp/ip, laser or deskjet). The same configuration works fine in pre V3.2 for all these printers (BTW, I only have HP)!

I am REALLY frustrated with this. Has anyone else had this problem? If so, could you PLEASE suggest a solution?

Now, you might say, "why not stick to V3.1 20030101 if its so great?" Well, that is an option. But I was trying to get the latest KNOPPIX I could get to start next term so my kids could use the latest GCC GCJ libraries as they keep getting updated (GCJ/JIG still doesn't have AWT or SWING quite right). I don't know about Balckdown Java....

Another alternative, I suppose, is to have the students still boot to a poor man's dual boot and then have them log-in to a server on the LAN that I have knx-hdinstalled with a full download of Sun's Java SDK 1.4.1.... How do i set-up a thin-client for this?

TIA,

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Here's an update. I was mistaken, the PC doesn't freeze as I can start other apps in KDE. However, the print job freezes!

Also, it would seem that KATE is not at fault. It must be CUPS. I wrote a C++ *.cc file in KWRITE and everything works except printing! Is there something wrong with the CUPS drivers or the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration tool????

What freezes is the app I'm printing from with some sort of message like:

generating print data
print page 1 <close>

This message just stays there and nothing prints. What's up with that!

ARRGGGHHHH!!!!! HELP!

[fingers99]

I'm not running 3.2, but in 3.1 I had to use the web page CUPS setup.

http://localhost:631/


Otherwise I could get no sense out of my printing.

Interesting that you're teaching C++ and (eeek!) Java. I'd have thought that Smalltalk (Squeak) or even Python might be more fun/more suitable at that level. :wink:

[A. Jorge Garcia]

To fingers99:
I never had a problem with CUPS in 3.1, but I'll try your suggestion! I just go in Konqueror and surf to http://localhost:631? What does that do?

As far as language is concerned, I've taught preAP and APCS since 1988 (program started in 1984) with various languages required at the college level that are not my choice (such as Pascal, C++ and now Java).

I'd like to try using GNU GCC's gcj for java on KNOPPIX as GNU GCC's g++ for c++ on KNOPPIX worked so well for us last year. BTW, we've even used QBASIC and VBASIC in the preCS class!

Regards,

[fingers99]

What does that do?

Just gives you CUPS native Webmin-like admin tool. It's "fairly" intuitive.

[A. Jorge Garcia]

To fingers99:
Well, I tried http://localhost:631 from Konqueror while running the KNOPPIX CD and got "could not connect to localhost posr 631."

Now what?

TIA!

[paradocs]

Hi All,

I am here to learn. I hope there are some good
posts about printer basics.

Greetings A. J. Garcia

I am working now from the DVD version with no hard drive.
I do get Kate to print on my HP722c
My printer shows up in
ControlCenter --> Peripherals -->Printers
I am sure you have tried this and suspect
this is the same as the latest CD version.

A solution I use at times is to print to a postscript
file xxxxxx.ps and then click on the postscript
file and it comes up in Konqueror which will then
print it. From the command line of VIM
---> :hardcopy>temp.ps

I know that you are expert a dealing with the students
and the powers that be -- so I understand that
a simple editor is best. But GVIM starting
in the insert mode is not too difficult and the color
highlighting printout is awesome.

Best Wishes
paradocs

[fingers99]

AJ, did you see this post?

http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3600

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Thanx fingers99, but that post didn't help either. It said to goto the a shell and type "sudo cupsd" but nothing happended. So I opened a root shell and typed just "cupsd" and only got the following output:
cupsd: Child exited with status 98!

What the heck is going on here???

I've tried the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration Tool with Local and Networked printers, with HP DeskJets and HP LaserJets, with the new recommended hp driver and with the old patched hp driver. BTW, all this worked fine in V3.1. Nothing Works Now!

I tried printing from KWrite and Kate, they freeze. BTW, I used those editors because of the syntax color coding for C++ and Java (that's all the IDE I need). Then I tried another app. I opened one of the LinuxTag *.pdf files on the CD with Acrobat, tried to print and BOOM freeze again!

The problem must be CUPS or the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration Tool.

REALLY FRUSTRATED,

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Is there something fundamentally different about how CUPS or the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration Tool works in V3.2 as compared to V3.1??? WHat am I missing. Am I clueless suddenly? Please clue me in!

TIA,

[Edwin]

Just a thought,


cupsd: Child exited with status 98!

If a child exits with a status other then 1 or 0 it usually means something has been going wrong. Could it be that cuspd is a little upset because of that? I ask this because in your second message you said that you could print from kWrite. In a later message you said you couldn't. Maybe because a earlier printjob from Kate has messed things up?

Easy to find out. Reboot. Open a shell. Run the 'cupsd' command. What does it say? Print from kWrite. Is this succesfull?. Run the 'cupsd' command again. What does it say this time? Print from Kate. This will probally fail. See what cupsd has to say. Print from kWrite. What happens? What does cupsd say?

I know it does not help you much directly, but it might help you to find out where the problem is: with cupsd or Kate.

The last would be a pity, I am rather fond of her myself.

Would downgrading Kate be an option?

Success!

- - Edwin

[A. Jorge Garcia]

To Edwin:
Sorry if I lead you to believe that I can print from KWrite, because I can't print from anything!!!!

ARRGGGHHH,

[mikehallsted]

are there specific reasons you are using v3.2?
if there are, then good luck in figuring it out.....
otherwise, if it was me, i would just one of the prior versions
since i would know that it all worked.

[A. Jorge Garcia]

To Mike:
Like I said, I've been using V3.1-2003_01_01 at school with no problems. But I need the latest Java libraries from GCC or BlackDown. Both projects are trying to make a GPL version of Sun's Java SDK 1.4.1.

I need this in teaching AP Computer Science next year as I have to teach Java for the first time. However, the SDK libraries in 2003_01_01 are incomplete as GCC and BlackDown are still works in progress.

I was hoping to keep up with their updates as KNOPPIX is updated. Doesn't Klauss update all the software included on the CD each time he uploads a new version (with apt-get, etc.)?

Anyway, I did a clean boot and cupsd worked in the root shell without error, but nothing else happened. So I used the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration Tool and tried to print. I get each app I try to print from to freeze again with a dialog box like

Printing document: test.cc
Generating print data: page 1
<close>

To Edwin:
When running cupsd after this happened, I get that excited child 98 error again. Is something wrong with the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration Tool after all???

OK, so I did another clean boot and http://localhost:631 did nothing in Konqueror. So I tried cupsd in the root shell and now I get an admin menu using http://localhost:631. Finally some progress. I haven't had a chance to play with this, but I am now at least hopeful that I'm going to get somehwere.

BTW, if I have success using http://localhost:631 now, that would mean the error is not in KATE (or anyother app I'm printing from), nor is the error with CUPS, its with the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration Tool! Something, I'm afraid, is seriously wrong with it!

To Klauss:
Are you listening?

[A. Jorge Garcia]

To Edwin:
OK, I figured-out when cupsd returns that "98" error. Right after I boot-up the KNOPPIX CD, sudo cupsd (in shell) returns nothing, but starts the cups daemon as http://localhost:631 (in konqueror) works only after that.

Now, whether I configure the printer with

<K><KNOPPIX><Configure><Configure printer(s)>
(the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration Tool)

or with

http://localhost:631
(the cups admin webpage)

I then get the error right away. This happens in shell with sudo cupsd even before printing from the app of my choice. So its not KATE. Also, its not the KNOPPIX Printer Configuration Tool. It must be a problem with CUPS itself.

To Paradox:
Thanx for your input, I now have the same results you have in the control center. However, printing as you suggest (with *.ps) is a bit too cumbersome for use on a daily basis with students....

To All:
There's another twist. I can't print from any app, but the CUPS admin webpage can send a test print job to my printer and it comes out just fine. What's up with that???

TIA,

[ViDER]

:? have you tried to find a newer librery of Java SDK 4 Linux/Red-Hat/
Unix/Knoppix...?

If you find it, simply try replysing the corent file on the CD (copy CD 2 HD
then look for tha file and change it with the new one, then reburn the CD,
with tha new version on it. :? this might work or might not, I'm talkin about
ver 3.1). hope it helped you out.

Sry 4 my mistakes. :wink:

[Edwin]

OK, I figured-out when cupsd returns that "98" error. Right after I boot-up the KNOPPIX CD, sudo cupsd (in shell) returns nothing, but starts the cups daemon as http://localhost:631 (in konqueror) works only after that.

Ok, so cupsd is not started at boot on your system. And I also think that "98" status is not an error after all. I played around with cups a little and get that status after a succesfull print-job. I have seen the source of a few *NIX programs and in those returning anything but 1 or 0 meant an error. Seemed like a good convention to me, but cupsd might have other ideas.


There's another twist. I can't print from any app, but the CUPS admin webpage can send a test print job to my printer and it comes out just fine.

Your're on to something here. This suggests the problem is _not_ cups. I just discovered /var/log/cups/error_log. This might shed some some light -or make your confusion all the greater- I cannot reproduce this problem and don't even know if this log is written to in a boot from CD. Another thing that you could try is to make a simple text file. Then in a console cd to the directory and type:
'lp -d <printername> <filename>'
Do this after another reboot and after starting cupsd again. What happens and what is in the logfile?

Succes,

- - Edwin

[A. Jorge Garcia]

To Vider:
I could go your route except for the fact that I lack the hardware resources necessary to remaster KNOPPIX! :(

To Edwin:
OK, like you said, we're on to something here! Edwin, I dare say that you are a genius! Thanx so much, at least now I can print plain text.

I set up my local DeskJet 930C as mrg in cups without any error in error_log. Then I shelled lp -d mrg test.cc and got it printed (a simple hello world type C++ program)! Now this will work in class. However, this is just text - no color, no graphics. The cups test page had plain text, color text, graphics, etc.! My students were used to printing from KATE with color coded syntax on the color printer. Why can't I print directly from KATE to mrg (short for Mr. G), or from any app for that mater (text or not)? BTW, the error_log showed nothing bad after the print-out either.

Also, I see what you mean about error codes other than 0 or 1. In fact, in my programs I use cerr or return other than 0 from main for any error (0 is my only "good" error).

BTW, with a liveCD bootable Linux distro, everything runs from RAM instead of the hdd (this includes the entire filesystem). So the error_log file is rw.

Regards,

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Am I the only one having all these difficulties printing with the latest KNOPPIX CD? I can't believe it, how can this be? I guess I've been spoiled with cups and the configuration tool....

I was so desperate recently that I rechecked the *.iso's md5sum (which I check right after downloading before burning anyway) and had no problem. I even tried the KNOPPIX testcd boot option and everything was OK. What gives here???

OK, so if its not cups, its probably not the Printer Configuration Tool either. BTW, its not KATE either because I printed (using ld) files created with KATE - I just can't print directly from KATE or any other app. SO WHAT IS WRONG???

BTW, this http://localhost web admin stuff is pretty convenient! Are there localhost options other than 631?

To Paradox:
You suggested saving files to *.ps (or maybe even *.pdf) to preserve the color text and or graphics in an output file. Then you can print that file thru some sort of filter, right? Why would you need to do this if you didn't have trouble printing too?

Regards,

[Edwin]

I set up my local DeskJet 930C as mrg in cups without any error in error_log. Then I shelled lp -d mrg test.cc and got it printed (a simple hello world type C++ program)! Now this will work in class. However, this is just text - no color, no graphics. The cups test page had plain text, color text, graphics, etc.! My students were used to printing from KATE with color coded syntax on the color printer.


I'm glad that you have now at least some print-capabillities that you can use in your classes. Now, if your students complain about the lack of color or graphics couldn't you turn that into a lesson about the importance of testing code before releasing it ;=) That is a lesson that cannot be teached too early, isn't it ;=)

But seriously, I think you should file a bug-report. It looks like something goes wrong in the interface between KDE applications and cups. The fact that cupsd is not started at boot has already been reported.



Am I the only one having all these difficulties printing with the latest KNOPPIX CD? I can't believe it, how can this be?


Start a new thread with a subject that clearly states the problem. The replies could help your bug-report.

If you want to go at the bottom of this, here's a few more suggestions.
- Use the greatest debugging-aid ever invented: don't look at a computer for a few days ;=)
- The Printer Configuration Utillity has in the toolbar a button 'print server'. Choose 'Configure' and browse the options. There could be something there that is obviously wrong. Keep in mind that this tool is just a front-end to a config-file (I think). It can have bugs as well.... Maybe better to edit the config-file directly....?
- In said 'Print Server Configuration Dialog' there is the option to set the level of logging. Set it to a higher level; like 'Full Debugging' or 'Errors'. I write this from memory, so these options might have other names, but you'll get the drift. After that go through the whole works again: print from Kate, check the log; print fom the console, check the log; and so on . Sprinkle with a few reboots.
- These reboots are maybe not needed. But when trouble-shooting a computer I do it frequently. It has to do with my experience in the Mac-world. And old habits die hard.
- Finally, there is some documention on cups: http://localhost:631/documentation.html

Succes,

- - Edwin

[A. Jorge Garcia]

>>
These reboots are maybe not needed. But when trouble-shooting a computer I do it frequently. It has to do with my experience in the Mac-world. And old habits die hard.
<<

To Edwin:
Yes, I do this too. However, I was thinking that it should only be necessary to kill offending processes (any frozen apps, cupsd itself). What do you think?

Anyway, so you think its something wrong with KDE? Its not just KDE apps I have trouble printing from. True, I've been using mainly KDE apps in class (Konqueror, Konsole, Kate) but I also opened a *.pdf file with acrobat reader and had the same trouble printing.

Maybe I should try some other apps or starting KNOPPIX with a different desktop manager. Does cups only work with KDE?

BTW, I've never submitted a bug report. What's involved? You say that the fact that cupsd doesn't start at boot-up has been reported. How do you know that? Did you report it? How do you see what's been reported? Is that in fact a bug? I never noticed if cupsd started at boo-up in other versions of KNOPPIX.

Regards,

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Here's a bit of an update.

Using both http://localhost:631 and the <K><KNOPPIX><CONFIGURE><CONFIGURE RPINTERS> have the same result. There are no errors when printing plain text files or *.ps files using ld in the error_log.

Also, the app freezes when I print directly to a named printer from KATE, KWRITE and ACROBAT. However, GVIM prints directly to the printer (without a print dialog). Also VIM and KONQUEROR print to a named printer with a dialog box.

Do you see a pattern here? I thought it was KDE apps that had a problem, but KONQUEROR is fine and ACROBAT is not???

What do you think, y'all?

Regards,

[j.drake]

Am I the only one having all these difficulties printing with the latest KNOPPIX CD? I can't believe it, how can this be? I guess I've been spoiled with cups and the configuration tool....


Oh, no, no, no, my friend. Please see my thread in the hardware section called "Newbie - print drivers". Sounds like you're having very similar problems to mine. Only I don't have any answer for you. Knoppix 3.2 is my first adventure into Linux, so I chalked it all up to my inexperience, and doubtless, that's a factor. But someone already pointed out that there is a known bug working here. Stephen, through his help and expertise in shell commands, has gotten me really close to getting through setting up a printer, but I'm not there yet.

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Hi J!

You mean
http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3632
right?

Yup, I just saw that thread. Thank God! I thought I was going insane....

Regards,

[Edwin]

Yes, I do this too. However, I was thinking that it should only be necessary to kill offending processes (any frozen apps, cupsd itself). What do you think?


Actually I don't think it is necessary in Linux. 'Rebooting is only for hardware updates' an old Linux-hand told me once. But old habits die hard. Frozen applications and such are probably very well handled with 'kill' or 'killall' or 'pgrep' or something else, but I haven't figured these out yet.



Anyway, so you think its something wrong with KDE? Its not just KDE apps I have trouble printing from.


Yes, I think so. KDE is after all the layer that sits on top of everything. Now I don't know how GUI programming under Linux works, but my reasoning is as follows: If your application needs to print you could go two ways. Call a low-level function like 'lp' or 'lpr' (yes, there is also a 'lpr' command - don't know why, probably to confuse newbies like me ;=) or call some function in the window manager's API. What would you do? I prefer the API way, and would write a wrapper around it, just in case. But this is Linux, there is no Code Police. As 'lp' works on your system I reckon something goes wrong in the API. Konqueror might use the low-level calls while Kate uses the API.

<BIGSMILE>Easy to find out. Download the source code and have a look</BIGSMILE>

BTW, does Mozilla print with your system? My version (1.0.0) uses the 'lpr' command.

The weird thing is that the problem is not consistent. There are more threads reporting printing problems. However I have tried a CD-boot on 5 different systems with Epson/Hp/Cannon on USB/Parallel/Network but can not reproduce the errors.



Maybe I should try some other apps or starting KNOPPIX with a different desktop manager. Does cups only work with KDE?


Trying a different desktop manager is certainly worth a shot. And cups is just a printserver. In Linux you need a printserver, even on a standalone machine, to be able to print. It should work with every desktop.



BTW, I've never submitted a bug report. What's involved? You say that the fact that cupsd doesn't start at boot-up has been reported. How do you know that? Did you report it? How do you see what's been reported? Is that in fact a bug? I never noticed if cupsd started at boo-up in other versions of KNOPPIX.


In the navigation bar at the top of this page is a tab 'Bugs'. That will take you to Bugzilla, a bug reporting and tracking tool. You have to register first. After that state your problem as clearly as you can and hope for the best. As to cupsd not starting up, in an earlier post you wrote:
OK, I figured-out when cupsd returns that "98" error. Right after I boot-up theKNOPPIX CD, sudo cupsd (in shell) returns nothing, but starts the cups daemon as http://localhost:631 (in konqueror) works only after that. I then searched Bugzilla on 'cups' which turned up bug #157. It's status is 'new', meaning it is not accepted yet. But I think it is a bug (it isn't exactly a feature is it :=).

BTW, this error I *could* reproduce. My 20030606 CD does not start cupsd. But now I have second thoughts: if cupsd is not started on your system, how could you set up a printer? Hmmm... this problem is wierd. And oh, from another thread I learned that the right way to start it is: '/etc/init.d/cupsys'. To check if it is running you can use 'lpstat -r'.

Good luck with your efforts,

Regards,

- - Edwin

[paradocs]

Hi All,

I am able to cause MrG's Kate problem working from KNOPPIX
DVD. I expect this version is the same as the latest CD with
respect to printing.

Kate prints just fine -- probably using lp as Edwin points out --
when printing simple black text. But when you ask for a color
syntax printout, Kate locks up and nothing happens. I expect
that an image file is made and then the program to print
out the postscript file is missing or faulty.

Dumb, old serial printers could not make pretty fonts and
picture -- but they jumped to work when you gave them
data and they didn't just sit ther thinking. :lol:

Best Wishes
paradocs

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Hi Paradox:
OK, so its something to do with processing color text.

I wrote the files test.txt and test.cc in KATE. I can edit, save and load these files just fine. They had the exact same contents (a simple hello world program in c++). KATE color codes test.cc on screen when saved, but not test.txt. I can print test.txt directly to a named printer from KATE, but printing test.cc locks-up KATE.

BTW, printing color coded text from KATE to any color device freezes too! If I print test.cc (color coded on screen) to a *.ps or *.pdf file, KATE freezes.

If I then open test.cc in VIM, the color coding is preserved and I can print to a color device, but some lines are missing (those that were not color coded, ie: remained black) when I create test.ps or test.pdf. I can then print test.ps from KONQUEROR or KGhostView and test.pdf from ACROBAT (acroread). In ACROBAT, I cannot specify the named printer, instead I enter lp as the Print To Print Command.

Also, I can print test.cc directly to a named printer from VIM with all the color coding intact and no missing lines. The colors are different than in KATE, but consistent with c++ syntax (comments are a certain color, strings are a different color, types are yet another color, etc.). If I open test.txt with VIM and print to the named printer, I get the expected plain text hardcopy too, but only if I highlight the desired text with the mouse (it also prints all those "~" symbols). Doing the same with gvim, I can print without naming the printer and without highlighting the text (and none of the "~" symbols print out). Using GVIM is odd in that you cannot specify a printer so it prints to the default CUPS printer. However, then you can't print to the *.ps or *.pdf file formats as you can in VIM.

BTW, when I open test.txt, test.ps or test.pdf in MOZILLA, I can print to the named printer. The file test.txt prints as plain text and the other files print in color (black lines are missing). MOZILLA uses gv for test.ps and acroread for test.pdf but prints to lpr from acroread.

I suppose it goes without saying that I configured my printer using <K><KONQUEROR><CONFIGURE><CONFIGURE PRINTERS> (http://localhost:631 works fine too) and I can print using lp just fine. When I print test.cc or test.txt using lp I get plain text (no color). When I print test.ps or test.pdf using lp I get the color coding, but the black lines are lost. If I cat /var/log/cups/error_log after I send each print job, it is evident that CUPS set up a filter for text, ps and pdf (texttops, pstops and pdftops respectively).

Regarding the kill command. I tried to isolate the frozen process (KATE after printing color coded text to a color device) with the shell command ps. I get a list of processes, but none specifying KATE. How do I isolate KATE's process number so I can kill it alone, and leave all other processes running?

EDIT: OOPS, sorry, I forgot about ps -A -F.

I find the root cause of all this very baffling. I don't see a pattern to these errors. Do you have any more ideas? Is it a problem with kdelib?

EDIT: BTW, I just entered this thread into BugZilla as bug #217.

TIA,

[Edwin]

From our last exciting episode:



Kate prints just fine -- probably using lp as Edwin points out --
when printing simple black text. But when you ask for a color
syntax printout, Kate locks up and nothing happens. I expect
that an image file is made and then the program to print
out the postscript file is missing or faulty.


And



OK, so its something to do with processing color text.


Now I hate to be a spoilsport, but I tested with a file named "test.php". When opened in Kate she syntax-colored it very nice. When printed from Kate it came out of the printer just as on the screen _INCLUDING ALL THE COLORS_. No freeze or lock-up. And that on 5 different systems. Hmmm....what is happening here?

But anyway, I did some reading on cups. Then I did some more printing. All from Kate, all to an Epson 580 color, all from the same cpu. I made 2 files, 'test.php' and 'test.txt'. 'test.php' syntax-colors in Kate, 'test.txt' does not. I printed both from Kate. This is from the error_log (Time-stamps removed for better readabillity):

Job 11 queued on 'epson' by 'edwin'.
Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstops (PID 1000) for job 11.
Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstoraster (PID 1001) for job 11.
Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/rastertoprinter (PID 1002) for job 11.
Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/usb (PID 1003) for job 11.

The output was the same for both files (except for the PID's and job-numbers).
Then I printed the files using the 'lp' command. This showed up in the logs:

Job 13 queued on 'epson' by 'edwin'.
Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/texttops (PID 1012) for job 13.
Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstops (PID 1013) for job 13.
Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstoraster (PID 1014) for job 13.
Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/rastertoprinter (PID 1015) for job 13.
Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/usb (PID 1016) for job 13.

From my reading I understand this to be the way cups works. But interesting is that the job is queued first, the filters are applied after that. And that Kate presents a PostScript file to cups, color-coded or not.

I am stabbing in the dark here, but maybe Kate makes a mistake when generating a PS-file with color-information. She sends the file to cups, waiting for the digital equivalent of a 'Thumbs-Up' from cups. Cups chokes on the file, not sending the 'Thumbs-Up'. So Kate just sits there. This 'thinking-aloud-stab' does not address the question why this only happens on your side of the ocean ;=)
Could you post your error_log entries after a failed print attempt? I wonder how far cups gets.



I find the root cause of all this very baffling. I don't see a pattern to these errors.


The only pattern I see is that, as far as I can see, you created your test.ps and test.pdf from VIM; any printing of them causes black text to disappear. The error is in the printer-driver that created them. But I might have overlooked something in your post. Did you try to print these files from Windows?
Apart from that, it could be a diabolical plot from the combined printer-producers to bump up their sales in ink or toner.... Ah well, I should turn in for the night. I think I'll do just that.



Dumb, old serial printers could not make pretty fonts and
picture


Yeah, and a lot of people created ascii-art to compensate. Manager-types thought it looked like working, so they left you to it. Beats the Internet as a time-waster ;=)



EDIT: OOPS, sorry, I forgot about ps -A -F.


Hey, thats what I have been looking for! Thank you!.

Regards,

- - Edwin

[A. Jorge Garcia]

OK, by now I'm desperate to accept just about any explanation why this isn't working right. You say its the ocean now? OK, makes sense, I live right by the Atlantic, so while I wasn't looking, aliens from the 4th dimension that came from the 23rd and 1/2 century mind controled whales off shore to come into my house over night to hack my copy of 20030606. Yup, that's it!

Now, seriously, you think its a problem with the print driver CUPS uses for my printer or the *.ps filter CUPS is using?

Well, here's my error log after boot and configuring printer "mrg" before I print anything. I'm out off my office for the summer, so I'm stuck testing on one local printer. If I were at work, I could test local vs. networked, inkjet verses laser, etc.

cat /var/log/cups/error_log
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:05 +0200] Listening to 0:631
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:05 +0200] Loaded configuration file "/etc/cups/cupsd.conf"
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:05 +0200] Configured for up to 100 clients.
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:05 +0200] Allowing up to 100 client connections per host.
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:05 +0200] Full reload is required.
E [22/Jul/2003:22:32:05 +0200] LoadAllClasses: Unable to open /etc/cups/classes.conf - No such file or directory
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:07 +0200] LoadPPDs: Read "/etc/cups/ppds.dat", 209 PPDs...
E [22/Jul/2003:22:32:07 +0200] LoadPPDs: Unable to write "/etc/cups/ppds.dat" - Read-only file system
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:07 +0200] Full reload complete.
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:58 +0200] Setting mrg device-uri to "parallel:/dev/lp0" (was "file:/dev/null".)
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:58 +0200] Saving printers.conf...
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:58 +0200] New printer 'mrg' added by ''.
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:58 +0200] Saving printers.conf...
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:58 +0200] Printer 'mrg' modified by ''.
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:58 +0200] Saving printers.conf...
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:58 +0200] Printer 'mrg' now accepting jobs ('').
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:58 +0200] Saving printers.conf...
I [22/Jul/2003:22:32:58 +0200] Printer 'mrg' started by ''.

Also, the test.txt and test.cc files print as plain text in M$ WINDOZE using M$ NOTEPAD. Further test.gs (with GV for WINDOZE) and test.pdf (Acrobat Reader for WINDOZE) print-out just the same as in KNOPPIX (still missing the black text).

I'm working on the rest of your post.

Regards,

[A. Jorge Garcia]

And the saga continues:

/var/log/cups/error_log is empty right after booting the CD.

After configuring the printer, the error_log was like my last post.

Job1 = test.pdf printed from ACROREAD to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This printed fine and in color text + no freeze! The only problem is that the black text never was written by VIM to the *.pdf file in the first place....
I [24/Jul/2003:12:02:45 +0200] Adding start banner page "none" to job 1.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:02:45 +0200] Adding end banner page "none" to job 1.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:02:45 +0200] Job 1 queued on 'mrg' by 'knoppix'.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:02:45 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstops (PID 1688) for job 1.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:02:45 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/foomatic-rip (PID 1689) for job 1.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:02:45 +0200] Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/parallel (PID 1690) for job 1.

Job2 = test.ps printed from KONQUEROR (which probably is using a GV plug-in) to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This printed fine and in color text + no freeze! The only problem is that the black text never was written by VIM to the *.ps file in the first place....
I [24/Jul/2003:12:09:08 +0200] Adding start banner page "none" to job 2.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:09:08 +0200] Adding end banner page "none" to job 2.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:09:08 +0200] Job 2 queued on 'mrg' by 'knoppix'.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:09:08 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstops (PID 2092) for job 2.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:09:08 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/foomatic-rip (PID 2093) for job 2.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:09:08 +0200] Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/parallel (PID 2094) for job 2.

Job3 = test.txt printed from KATE to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This printed fine and in plain text (no color) + no freeze!
I [24/Jul/2003:12:12:18 +0200] Adding start banner page "none" to job 3.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:12:18 +0200] Adding end banner page "none" to job 3.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:12:18 +0200] Job 3 queued on 'mrg' by 'knoppix'.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:12:18 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstops (PID 2321) for job 3.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:12:18 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/foomatic-rip (PID 2322) for job 3.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:12:18 +0200] Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/parallel (PID 2323) for job 3.

JobX = test.cc printed from KATE to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This did not print anything (should have been in color text) + KATE froze! There was no entry for this job (should have been Job4) in the error_log....

Job4 = test.pdf printed with lp to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This printed fine and in color text! The only problem is that the black text never was written by VIM to the *.pdf file in the first place....
I [24/Jul/2003:12:18:33 +0200] Adding start banner page "none" to job 4.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:18:33 +0200] Adding end banner page "none" to job 4.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:18:33 +0200] Job 4 queued on 'mrg' by 'knoppix'.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:18:33 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pdftops (PID 2741) for job 4.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:18:33 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstops (PID 2742) for job 4.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:18:33 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/foomatic-rip (PID 2743) for job 4.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:18:33 +0200] Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/parallel (PID 2744) for job 4.

Job5 = test.ps printed with lp to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This printed fine and in color text! The only problem is that the black text never was written by VIM to the *.ps file in the first place....
I [24/Jul/2003:12:20:07 +0200] Adding start banner page "none" to job 5.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:20:07 +0200] Adding end banner page "none" to job 5.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:20:07 +0200] Job 5 queued on 'mrg' by 'knoppix'.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:20:07 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstops (PID 2849) for job 5.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:20:07 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/foomatic-rip (PID 2850) for job 5.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:20:07 +0200] Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/parallel (PID 2851) for job 5.

Job6 = test.txt printed with lp to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This printed fine and in plain text (no color)!
I [24/Jul/2003:12:22:01 +0200] Adding start banner page "none" to job 6.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:22:01 +0200] Adding end banner page "none" to job 6.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:22:01 +0200] Job 6 queued on 'mrg' by 'knoppix'.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:22:01 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/texttops (PID 2974) for job 6.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:22:01 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstops (PID 2975) for job 6.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:22:01 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/foomatic-rip (PID 2976) for job 6.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:22:01 +0200] Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/parallel (PID 2977) for job 6.

Job7 = test.cc printed with lp to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This printed fine and in plain text (no color)!
I [24/Jul/2003:12:23:09 +0200] Adding start banner page "none" to job 7.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:23:09 +0200] Adding end banner page "none" to job 7.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:23:09 +0200] Job 7 queued on 'mrg' by 'knoppix'.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:23:09 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/texttops (PID 3056) for job 7.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:23:10 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/pstops (PID 3057) for job 7.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:23:10 +0200] Started filter /usr/lib/cups/filter/foomatic-rip (PID 3058) for job 7.
I [24/Jul/2003:12:23:10 +0200] Started backend /usr/lib/cups/backend/parallel (PID 3059) for job 7.

BTW, the file test.cc is as follows.

//main routine
int main()
{
cout << "This is a test!!!" << endl;
return 0;
}

This is exactly what printed-out in Job3, Job6 and Job7. The color print-outs (Job1, Job2, Job4 and Job5) only show the following.

//main routine <--blue
int <--green

"This is a test!!!" <--red
return <--orange 0 <--red

These are the on-screen colors in ACROREAD and KONQUEROR(GV). The original colors in KATE are as follows.

//main routine <--grey
int <-- brown main() <--black
{ <--black
cout <--black << "This is a test!!!" <--red << endl; <--black
return <--bold black 0 <--blue ; <--black
} <--black

In other words, the print driver used in VIM to convert to *.ps or *.pdf file formats lost all the black code. Needless to say that VIM also has different color coded syntax to start with.

Regards,

[j.drake]

Well, Jorge, you're doing better than I am. I guess there are (gulp) some benefits to MSW.

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Hi J!

By MSW do you mean, may heaven forfend, M$ Word or M$ WINDOZE?

OMG, BTW, I just figured out why I'm not getting the black text from VIM! The so-called black text is that text that was color coded black by KATE. The problem is that VIM acts like a Konsole Shell and defaults to white on black text for the "black"text. The colored text (not black) is ok. When I change the color schema to black on white everything prints from VIM to mrg (my printer) in color text just fine including the black text.

This is also why my *.ps and *.pdf files didn't display the "black" text on-screen and didn't print it either. VIM was converting to *.ps or *.pdf with white text! I just figured that out by printing test.cc from GVIM which adds some GUI-styled pull-down menus and defaults to black on white! Also, after changing the schema in VIM, I was able to create *.ps and *.pdf files that were complete with "black" text and printed everything fine.

You can also change the size of the font from "huge" to "small" do get a normal print-out. I wonder if there's a way to get VIM or GVIM not to print all those crazy "~" symbols down the length of the page.

Still, the original problem remains, why do KATE and KWRITE freeze when trying to print in color text????

Regards,

[j.drake]

By MSW do you mean, may heaven forfend, M$ Word or M$ WINDOZE?

MSW = MS Windows. If MSW had ever given me half the trouble that this OS has, or been as difficult to troubleshoot, I would have switched to Mac a long time ago. OTOH, I'm just playin' now. That's why I like Knoppix. Being on a bootable CD, there's no marriage, and I can go back whenever I want. If I had to actually rely on this to earn a living or get an education, I would have switched distros a while back. Sort of supports the get what you pay for theme.

I know that's a controversial thing to say here. I read somewhere that Unix fans love Unix and Linux fans hate MS. But MS would have gone bankrupt sometime before the DOS 3.3 release if they had ever turned loose of an OS that couldn't print.

That having been said, I know from talking to others that this release is more exception than rule, and that overall, Linux has by far more stability. It's just not ready to be a mainstream UI, not yet. But it will. And I want to be prepared for it when it happens.

MSW, in the context I mentioned, <> MS Word, which, as far as I'm concerned, is all but completely irrelevant now that we have OpenOffice for free, and both StarOffice and WordPerfect suites have become dirt cheap. There's no justification any more for paying good money for MS Word or MSOffice, IMNSHO.

Anyway, I'm still frustrated. Maybe I'll feel differently if I can ever get the stupid thing to print its own name.

[Edwin]

Well, three pages to this thread already. How nice ;=)

First, to cheer ourselves up a little we can think of people trying to trouble-shoot this sort of problems on Windows.......They get worthless stack-dumps, we get nice log-files.....:=))



After configuring the printer, the error_log was like my last post.


Ok, this output matches the output I get when I boot from CD and set up a printer. Except of course for the differences in printer name and device assignment (for me it is USB).
So the printer set-up is not the problem, right?



JobX = test.cc printed from KATE to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This did not print anything (should have been in color text) + KATE froze! There was no entry for this job (should have been Job4) in the error_log....


I am going to think aloud again. Everyone, please check my logic.

- Cups was invented to be able to print to any device: from the el cheapo Epson junk that sits on my desk to a $40,000 high-resolution RIP-printer.
- To do this it uses the concept of filters. These filters can be chained. For this to work the output of a filter must be in a format that the next filter understands.
- Unix programs, when printing, output PostScript or raw text.
- When text, cups converts it to PostScript. That's the 'texttops' filter in the log.
- Now we have PostScript. Cups uses the 'pstops' filter to convert it in a PS-file that the next filter will understand.
- If you're so lucky to have a PostScript printer the PS-file is piped to the printer.
- if you are not so lucky: what happens next is device-dependant. Meaning, cups needs information from the printer-driver and/or PPD. Why I think this I'll explain later.

Now, Kate produces PostScript, even when printing a plain (not colored-coded) file. I had hoped things would fail in the device-dependant part of the processing. But evidently we don't even get that far. And that just does not make sense. I can buy that somehow Kate makes a mistake when producing her PS file. And that my driver is more forgiving than yours.
But having Kate crash/freeze when doing her job on your system and not on mine? And we are talking about a CD-boot here. Maybe that whale-theory is not so bad after all. Or it is global warming. A disruption of the earth-magnetic field?

If you haven't given up by now, haven't punched out your computer, and are willing to to do some more trouble-shouting here is three things you can do:
- From Kate, with test.cc, which you know will not print, print and choose 'print preview' in the dialog. What happens? A freeze or a window showing a preview? Are the colors there?
- Before outputting the line 'Adding start banner page....etc' in the log, a lot has already happened in cups. Set the log-level in cups to 'debug'. This will produce some 1000 lines per print-job. So do this after setting up your printer and only on a print-job known to fail (test.cc from Kate). Start at the end of the log and see where the error occurs. If you really want to have some fun set the level to 'detailed debug information': that will produce some 5000 lines per job.
- Download the new version of Knoppix and see what happens there. (my gut-feeling is it will not work, but who knows)
- Real desperate shot in the dark here (and read that as really, really desperate): disable spooling, send to the printer direct (won't work either, but who knows)

Otherwise, you have discovered a few work-arounds for this problem. Resort to those. I am sure that the syntax-coloring in Kate and VIM or GVIM can be matched.

And now why do I think that the processing in cups after that 'pstops' filter is device-dependant? From your log you can see that only one filter is applied: 'foomatic-rip".
In my log two filters are applied: 'pstoraster' and 'rastertoprinter'.
I set up a new named printer (same brand and model) but choose another driver. My normal driver is 'cups+gimp'. The new driver was called 'foomatic+gimp+print ijs'.
That driver works as well, but the log showed that only one filter was applied: 'cupsomatic'.

Well, this was a long post. I hope it made some sense.
Anyone discovering flaws in it: please point them out. Flaming allowed ;=)

Regards,

- - Edwin

[Edwin]

I don't want to turn this in a OS-war; there are better places for that. But I can't resist this.



But MS would have gone bankrupt sometime before the DOS 3.3 release if they had ever turned loose of an OS that couldn't print.


Well actually they have done that. It was called Windows 3.11. I don't know which version of DOS it used, but printing anything over 20 pages (be it text or WORD) crashed any computer we had in our office then. Found a stagiaire that needed to print her report for an evalution the next day in tears one evening (and six crashed computers). Brought my Mac to the rescue. Printed the report. Stagiaire happy. Her teacher (the next day) happy too.

Thank you MicroSoft. I spend the rest of the evening sorting out the crashed computers.

But the game-plan was to sort out the stagiaire.

Cheers,

- - Edwin

[Stephen]

[quote]

I know that's a controversial thing to say here. I read somewhere that Unix fans love Unix and Linux fans hate MS. But MS would have gone bankrupt sometime before the DOS 3.3 release if they had ever turned loose of an OS that couldn't print.



I don't think hate is the word I think total and utter disgust for a morally bankrupt company would be more like it. And speaking of bankrupt just how was that supposed to happen when every X86 computer produced had to pay the MS tax for that wonder of an OS that was DOS/Windows even if you did not have any intention of installing I remember having many arguments on the phone with suppliers telling them were putting Novel on this machine we don't need a DOS license they would say no that's just how it is you want the computer you pay MS and it is still that way today for the most part. For a company that has extorted as much money from the computing public as it has it should have the most secure reliable OS on the planet but sadly that is not the case and they don't even seem to care. Just my 2 cents and worth every penny.

[paradocs]

Hi Mr.G

I think we need a philosophical approach here--
like when a tree falls where no one is present,
is there any noise?

I expect that VIM not printing black has to
do with a similar paradox. If you assume a
black background and you print in black --
is there any printing there?

If you put black paper in your printer you
would never miss the black print -- voila!

Best Wishes
paradocs

[j.drake]

Well actually they have done that. It was called Windows 3.11. I don't know which version of DOS it used, but printing anything over 20 pages (be it text or WORD) crashed any computer we had in our office then.

All I know is that it's 20 pages more than I've managed to get so far!

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Edwin:
So as not to reinvent the wheel, I'm going to try 2003.0725 first just in case Klauss's KDE updates fixes things!

Paradox:
I like your style - very funny. BTW, I almost did put black paper in my printer....

J:
You mean you can't print ANYTHING at all??? What printer are you printing to? What driver does CUPS assign it? What kind of file are you printing? What's your error_log look like? Are you printing with lp or what app are your printing from?

To All:
Well now at least all the "black" text problem is obviated! Sorry, I introduced that problem by way of trying to track down the color printing problem from KATE. Unfortunately, this only served to obfiscate the original problem!

Regards,

[j.drake]

You mean you can't print ANYTHING at all??? What printer are you printing to? What driver does CUPS assign it? What kind of file are you printing? What's your error_log look like? Are you printing with lp or what app are your printing from?

Squat. Zip, Zero, Nada. Printer won't dance, hum, shake or do anything. My efforts, and the responses from the OS are chronicled in the other thread. I'm not familiar enough with the OS to snag an error log. Tell me how, and I'll try to post one this weekend, if you and the others would be kind enough to help. I'm most grateful for the help I've gotten thus far, but I got the impression from the other post that I'm just stuck without printing until the next release (assuming that it fixes the bug).

I have 2 printers, and Epson Stylus C40UX color inkjet, which someone (I think Stephen, IIRC) pointed out is supposed to work perfectly; the other is a Brother laser all-in-one (MFC-6800). See, I can't even get through the printer setup - the printers are blissfully ignorant of Knoppix's sheer existence in the world, and have absolutely no idea that anyone is attempting to send output their way. Originally, KDE was telling me that I lacked permissions to set up printers, then someone told me how to set up a root password and run the wizard as an administrator. KDE finally recognized the Epson (or said it did), but returned an error when I tried to print a test page. The Brother didn't even make it that far. As far as apps and document types are concerned, I haven't made it that far - I'm still trying to get a test page. As for the driver, I thought CUPS was supposed to do that, so I haven't the vaguest.

[Edwin]

I'm not familiar enough with the OS to snag an error log. Tell me how, and I'll try to post one this weekend, if you and the others would be kind enough to help.


The error log is /var/log/cups/error_log. Assuming you are running from the CD: Reboot, start cups then open this file in an editor, say Kate. The log will be empty. Turning on line-numbering can be helpfull. Now go through the motions of setting up your Epson. Go as far as the system will let you. Have a look at the log again. Kate will inform you the file has changed, do you want to reload. Click yes and see what is in the log.
If you are not booting from CD, or the log is not empty for some reason, just remember the last line-number and post the messages after that.



I have 2 printers, and Epson Stylus C40UX color inkjet, which someone (I think Stephen, IIRC) pointed out is supposed to work perfectly; the other is a Brother laser all-in-one (MFC-6800).


Stephen is right. I just set one up on my system. Worked with both drivers. I can even use it to print (colors and all) on my Epson Stylus C580. As for the Brother, I don't see that model in the wizard's list, but you could try another MFC model.
And you shouldn't need root privileges to set up printers; I do it as user all the time. To start cups you do however.



As for the driver, I thought CUPS was supposed to do that, so I haven't the vaguest.


Yes, but you must select a driver. In the wizard, right after you select your make and model there is a page where you can select a driver. Select the 'cups+gimp' one for your Epson.

And oh, as you get your first error when printing a testpage, skip that step the first time. If that doesn't work, restart cups and try again, this time with testpage.

Success,

- - Edwin

[j.drake]

And you shouldn't need root privileges to set up printers; I do it as user all the time. To start cups you do however.

Right, but the problem was that all of the choices in the printer setup wizard were grayed out, with an error essentially stating, IIRC, that it could not locate the CUPS server. When I reported that error, it was suggested to me that I needed to log in to the root in order to restart CUPS, which I did. Once I restarted CUPS, the wizard said something that indicated that I needed administrative privileges (sorry I can't be more specific right now, but I'm working off of a nearly week-old memory). Once I clicked the adminisrator button, then the choices were no longer grayed out, and I was allowed to go through the printer setup. All looked good until I tried to print a test page.


Yes, but you must select a driver. In the wizard, right after you select your make and model there is a page where you can select a driver. Select the 'cups+gimp' one for your Epson.

Well, if that's the case, then I'll wager that's my problem. I was setting it to CUPS.

I'll give it another shot this weekend. and let you know.

Thanks again to all.

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Oh well, even with 20030725, I still cannot print colored text from KATE to my HP DeskJet 930C (foomatic + hpijs) [recommended] by CUPS.

BTW, the whales were not at fault as I tested my download with md5sum. I thought that as I downloading over night, that maybe they got in the house behind my back again....

Regards,

[paradocs]

Hi All

I will add some printer specific data that might help
with sorting this all out.

KATE color printing freezes up with a CD (DVD KNOPPIX4) booted
system, Parallel port for my printers:
HP DeskJet 722c (Foomatic _ pnm2ppa)
Epson 1280 with both drivers (CUPS+Gimp-Print v4.2.5)
and (Foomatic + gimp-print-ijs)

I only use 115 volts -- maybe we need 240? :)

Best Wishes
paradocs

[A. Jorge Garcia]

I'm getting close to throwing in the towel on this. I mean, you ever here of a "brewing a tempest in a teapot?" Well, if all that's broke is color text printing from KATE to a color printer, but I can print from GVIM (and everything else) ok, then that will have to do I guess...

OK, so I've got a little survey for you to organize this a little:

(1) Can anyone print color text from KATE to your printer?

(2) Do you have any other printer issues?

(3) Do you use CUPS to configure your printer?

(4) Are you printing directly from an app or with lp?

BTW, I can't find that debugging tool, Edwin, you keep mentioning that gives 1000s of lines of error_log!

Are we approaching the point of diminishing returns here, or can we really track down this bug? What do you think?

[Edwin]

BTW, I can't find that debugging tool, Edwin, you keep mentioning that gives 1000s of lines of error_log!

Are we approaching the point of diminishing returns here, or can we really track down this bug? What do you think?



I think we are very close to the end here. Apart from having a look at the actual source-code, something I am not going to do. But it will be interesting to see when Kate freezes: before or after passing her file to cups. Then I will summarize the findings from this and other threads and submit a bug-report at the KDE site.

For the debugging tool, start cups if necessary and go to the printmanagement in the Control Center. At the top is a toolbar with buttons as 'Add', 'Printer', 'Print Server'. Click 'Print Server' and choose "Configure Server' from the menu. If that toolbar is not there, right-click somewhere in between the listed printers and choose 'Configure Server'.

In the dialog is a page 'Log'. There you can set the log-level to 'Debug'.

If nothing shows up in the log it is Kate, else it is cups crashing on Kate's output.

Good luck

- - Edwin

PS: Tomorrow I'll try to locate that step-down transformer I must have somewhere. See what happens when on 115 Volt. ;-)

[A. Jorge Garcia]

I think I'm going to have to change the title of this thread from "Seriously miffed..." to "Much ado about nothing" pretty soon....

I'm going to try out this CUPS Server debugging tool later and see what happens. If we get no new info, I think this bug is out of our hands.

I suppose we're going to have to leave it up to KDE updates. Are we agreed then that its a KDE error? It certainly isn't CUPS as I can print color text to my color printer from other apps like GVIM. Also, its not just KATE, but KWRITE too.

We still have to help out j.drake somehow even if we drop this thread....

Oh, and stepping up to 240V just fried my PC. I'm suing!

Qa'pla,

[A. Jorge Garcia]

If you experience the same problems with KATE, maybe you should add your two cents by voting for bug#217 in bugzilla.

BTW, look what I just got as a reply from bugzilla:

sometimes you just need to wait some time for the print-filter to work (10min or more!)

I've never heard of such a thing, have you? If so, this isn't very reliable is it!

Regards,

[A. Jorge Garcia]

OK, I just did the detailed debug in the CUPS server and got tons of lines in the error_log when printing my color text file (test.cc) to my color printer from KATE. KATE still crashes, I still get no hardcopy, I still have to kill the KATE process and I get a ton of lines starting with "d" or "D" in the error_log that don't help me at all....

I give up!

ARRGGGHHHH!!!!!

Regards,

[j.drake]

Yes, but you must select a driver. In the wizard, right after you select your make and model there is a page where you can select a driver. Select the 'cups+gimp' one for your Epson.

I went back and didn't see that option. Where do I select this? In the drop box in the lower right of the wizard window, I saw CUPS and Generic Linux and a couple of others, but I didn't see a choice for CUPS + GIMP. Am I looking in the right place?

Thanks.

[Edwin]

I went back and didn't see that option. Where do I select this? In the drop box in the lower right of the wizard window, I saw CUPS and Generic Linux and a couple of others, but I didn't see a choice for CUPS + GIMP. Am I looking in the right place?


I don't think so. What you are referring to is the Print Manager screen in the Control Center. At the top is a list of already installed printers. Below that is a drop-box with a couple of options. This sets your *printserver*. Yes, this is Linux and it _is_ confusing, but even on a stand-alone machine you need a printserver. To make it less confusing think of this as a *printservice*. Just leave this box set to cups. Now start the wizard to set up your printer. Do this by clicking 'Add' in the toolbar and selecting 'printer/class'. If you don't have a toolbar right-click somewhere between the printers in the list and select 'Add Printer/Class' from the popup-menu.

Follow the wizard. At a certain point you have to select make and model of your printer. After that the wizard searches it's database for the driver. If it has more than one it will ask you to select one (here is where you select the 'cups+gimp') . If it has only one it will use that (without asking). If it has none it will inform you so.

Of course the things I said in my earlier post about starting cups first and the error_log still apply.

Good Luck,

- - Edwin
(by now wondering what was wrong with mechanical typewriters in the first place ;-)

[A. Jorge Garcia]

I just hauled my old Brother Typewritter out of the attic....

Regards,

[j.drake]

I went back and didn't see that option. Where do I select this? In the drop box in the lower right of the wizard window, I saw CUPS and Generic Linux and a couple of others, but I didn't see a choice for CUPS + GIMP. Am I looking in the right place?


I don't think so. What you are referring to is the Print Manager screen in the Control Center. At the top is a list of already installed printers. Below that is a drop-box with a couple of options. This sets your *printserver*. Yes, this is Linux and it _is_ confusing, but even on a stand-alone machine you need a printserver. To make it less confusing think of this as a *printservice*. Just leave this box set to cups. Now start the wizard to set up your printer. Do this by clicking 'Add' in the toolbar and selecting 'printer/class'. If you don't have a toolbar right-click somewhere between the printers in the list and select 'Add Printer/Class' from the popup-menu.

Follow the wizard. At a certain point you have to select make and model of your printer. After that the wizard searches it's database for the driver. If it has more than one it will ask you to select one (here is where you select the 'cups+gimp') . If it has only one it will use that (without asking). If it has none it will inform you so.

Of course the things I said in my earlier post about starting cups first and the error_log still apply.

Good Luck,

- - Edwin
(by now wondering what was wrong with mechanical typewriters in the first place ;-)

I never got it to work this way, despite several tries, but when I re-read Jorge's comment in the other thread, I tried K -> Knoppix -> Configure -> Configure Printers. It went smoothly and all is well (at least for the Epson). Thanks to all of you for your help. Now I just need to find a driver for my Brother all-in-one. :D

[A. Jorge Garcia]

dittos!

EDIT: IE, the Alleluias sung to Beethoven from the other thread....

[Edwin]

I never got it to work this way, despite several tries, but when I re-read Jorge's comment in the other thread, I tried K -> Knoppix -> Configure -> Configure Printers. It went smoothly and all is well

Hmm.... The two procedures seem identical to me, except that by going through the K-menu this module is displayed in it's own window and not in a frame in the Control Center. I can't imagine that there is duplicated code for these two methods. Great that it worked, but it is wierd.



Are we agreed then that its a KDE error?


Yes. Kate and Kwrite probably use the same mechanism to convert their internal format to PostScript. And something goes wrong there.



BTW, look what I just got as a reply from bugzilla:

sometimes you just need to wait some time for the print-filter to work (10min or more!)


This is ridiculous! What is it supposed to do in those 10 minutes? Run Seti@home? Disprove the Collatz conjecture? Sending secret messages to the whales?



OK, I just did the detailed debug in the CUPS server and got tons of lines in the error_log when printing my color text file (test.cc) to my color printer from KATE. KATE still crashes, I still get no hardcopy, I still have to kill the KATE process and I get a ton of lines starting with "d" or "D" in the error_log that don't help me at all....


If I have led you to believe that turning on this tool would somehow enable your printing I apologize. All this tool does is give some insight on what is going on in CUPS's internals. I never expected it to get this far, somehow guessing that Kate crashed before passing her output to CUPS. I am more than willing to have a look at your error log. I want to report this at Bugzilla on the KDE site. And having been on the recieving end of bug-reports I know that the more detail the better. So if you are willing to go through the motions one more time...

Boot from CD, start CUPS if necessary, install printer and _then_ set the log-level to 'Debug Information'. And please don't choose 'Detailed Debugging': that output is so enormous it can kill a whale.
Do whatever you have to do to save the error_log and send as a attachment to:

<evanmaastrigt> <wanadoo> <nl>

My mailbox is relatively spam-free and I intend to keep it that way. So in the above address remove spaces, greater- and lesser than chars, and insert an "at" and a "dot" char at the right place.

And if paradocs is reading this and is willing to go through this: send me your error_log as well. Might help a lot actually.

Regards,

- - Edwin

PS: sorry for not responding earlier, but running on 115 Volts makes my computer a wee bit slow ;-)

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Edwin:
Sorry I wasn't clear! No, you did not lead me to believe that the debug setting would be a fix. What I meant to say was: for all those 1000's of debug lines, I'm no closer to a solution.

Also, do you really want me to email you that error_log? Have you been able to make head or tail of one of htese huge error_logs before? Are you one of the developers, then?

All:
Anyway, isn't that bugzilla report ridiculous! I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw that! Talk about unreliable, if it were true.

BTW, this must be some sort of record - we have nearly 5 pages in this one thread already! Now, if I post the error_log debug setting, we'll have at least 10 more.... :lol:

Regards,

[Edwin]

Also, do you really want me to email you that error_log? Have you been able to make head or tail of one of htese huge error_logs before? Are you one of the developers, then?


Yes, I do like to have a look at that error_log, and no, I am not one of the developers. I can't garanty anything of course but I have been doing some reading on CUPS. There are a lot good resources out there, including tutorials on how to read that error_log. Those were in German, but I can read that good enough. Just for fun I simulated a few errors (printing to non-existent printers, mucking up a PostScript file and then printing it) and I could spot the errors. And I noticed a couple of threads on the German Knoppix forum describing the sort of problem you have.

"If you never shoot, you will always miss" is a saying in my country. So, email me that file, I'll have a shot at it, if I can't locate the error it will still help with a bug report: I'll just put in on a website and include a link to it.

Any way, if I have to choose between figuring out a 1000-line Linux error_log and a 1000-line VBasic program I'll take the first option anytime :-)



BTW, this must be some sort of record - we have nearly 5 pages in this one thread already! :


Let's keep it running; we could win the price for the longest thread on this forum: a free copy of Knoppix ;-)

Regards,

- - Edwin

[j.drake]

I never got it to work this way, despite several tries, but when I re-read Jorge's comment in the other thread, I tried K -> Knoppix -> Configure -> Configure Printers. It went smoothly and all is well

Hmm.... The two procedures seem identical to me, except that by going through the K-menu this module is displayed in it's own window and not in a frame in the Control Center. I can't imagine that there is duplicated code for these two methods. Great that it worked, but it is wierd.


I'm with you.

A couple of clarifications are in order. First, I did still do the root login and CUPS restart prior to going through the K menu, but I did this only because I tried it going through the shell to the control center first, and it didn't work, and I looged in root and restarted CUPS and tried it again, and it still didn't work, and then I tried going through K and it did work. I didn't have time to reboot and see it it would set up without the root login and CUPS restart. Second, this time around I was using the 7-26-03 download. I doubt that this made a difference, as I initially had the same problem in the control center, but it is possible that the newer release might have helped.

Anyway, it doesn't really matter to me as long as I can print, but I wanted to clarify in case it might help someone else.

[A. Jorge Garcia]

OK, I'll try the debug error_log again tomorrow I hope. I'll email you if I get the time to play....

TIA,

[j.drake]

Now I just need to find a driver for my Brother all-in-one. :D

Success :!: :!: I got printed output from my Brother MFC-6800 using the HL-730 driver already defined in Knoppix. It's a foomatic driver (whatever the H that means). Thanks for the link, Edwin.

Also, I confirmed that I DO NOT have to set up a root password or restart CUPS to set up either printer, provided that I go via <K> <configure><configure printers> as Jorge suggested. Thanks, Jorge!

If things keep going well, I may have to look up how to do the HD installation with LILO.

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Hey, that's great news j! There was a time there that I thought we weren't getting to your problem. Well I guess that time is past!

Now you want to do an HD install??? OK, you are just out of control, man. This is just getting too scary for me.... :lol:

PS: Houston, we have page 5!

Good luck,

[j.drake]

Now you want to do an HD install??? Not yet. I'm not ready to marry the penguin, not just yet. OTOH, I did post a new thread that touches on this issue, having to do with my inability to see my C: drive when booting from CD. See http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3936

[A. Jorge Garcia]

OK, I replied to

http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3936

see what you think.

Regards,

[Edwin]

It's a foomatic driver (whatever the H that means).



Foomatic is a database-driven system for integrating free software printer drivers with common spoolers under Unix. It supports CUPS, LPRng, LPD, GNUlpr, PPR, PDQ, CPS, and direct printing with every free software printer driver known to us and every printer known to work with these drivers.


If you want to know how it got it's name: http://www.linuxprinting.org/foomatic-about.html

- - Edwin

[ILoveChessAndCompScience]

Don't worry AJ! :shock: It'll be all better soon!!!! :P :roll: :wink: :twisted: :arrow:

[A. Jorge Garcia]

BUMP!

OK, I figured out this whole mess. For some reason, on my knoppix-installer as knoppix home PC, everytime I boot into KNOPPIX I have to pretend to configure my printer again. I go <K><KNOPPIX><CONFIGURE><CONFIGURE PRINTERS> and just click on the printer that I defined previously, then all is well. I can print from any app, KDE or Otherwise! Don't know why I need to do this, but that's the work around.

Regards,

[ILoveChessAndCompScience]

OMG! No kidding?
:D :) :( :o :lol: 8) :? :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :x :P :oops: :cry: :wink: :roll: :twisted: :evil: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow:

GO AJ!!!!!!