Shopping List (Part II)

[Cuddles]

(1) After -=-finally-=- getting ALSA to work on my system, whew, now I am having sound quality issues. No hardware was changed, wires, setups as far as how the hardware is set up, just ALSA vs the "default" installed sound from Knoppix.

I can play an audio cd through XMMS and hear a low clicking noise that runs about every five seconds. Both Audacity and ReZound have this problem: I can play a external (line) input device audio, it sounds fine, I hit record, it appears to have recorded fine, until I play the recorded sound back, or save the sound to disk and play it back through any player, I get noise -=- like a static sound -=- that accompanies any sound. When the sound is silent, so is the noise, but as the sound gets louder, so too does the noise. I have tried different volume levels, and same result. What is the big deal with ALSA, I didn't have any of these problems with the "default" sound in Knoppix.

(2) After doing the apt-get upgrade from hell, I now show a 235.8 MEG device, named tmpfs, with a mount point of /dev/shm - where did this come from, and why? It currently shows no space usage, but what is it?

(3) How do you auto-start a program in a user login? Now that I have ALSA, I like to have the mixer up and viewable, but leaving AlsaMixerGUI just running when I log out, does not bring it back up when I re-login. So, how would I get it so that this "program" runs when my user logs in?

(4) ReZound - since I have been having so many problems with Audacity, a nice "feature" of getting ALSA running on my system is that ReZound NOW will let me record, as it wouldn't before. Problem is that it appears that ReZound likes to write to memory while you are recording, considering limited memory, and abundant hard disk free space, and the fact I am recording up to 50 minutes of continuous sound, memory could/will run out. Does anyone know a way to "point" ReZound to working on the hard drive, or a temp folder, instead of memory?

(5) Anyone ever work with a SanDisk Flash Reader (ImageMate II CompactFlash USB), connected to the USB, in Debian/Knoppix? What file system does it use? (ain't vfat thats for sure!)

Sorry for the collection of questions, but since Knoppix.Net was down for almost a day in my part of the world, I collected a few questions while I waited for its return...

Thanks for any and all assistance...
Cuddles

[fingers99]

I can play a external (line) input device audio, it sounds fine, I hit record, it appears to have recorded fine, until I play the recorded sound back, or save the sound to disk and play it back through any player, I get noise -=- like a static sound -=- that accompanies any sound.

You say "any player" -- do you mean any external player? I came across the same issue when using line in on my TV card. The sound from the TV application would be fine, but I'd get static on Xmms and so on. The solution was just to turn the volume on line in down.

Some ideas about your other questions (don't regard them as particularly authoritative!):

3. From the Kde manual :o


To launch programs when KDE is started, do the following:


Procedure 6.1.


Open the Autostart folder. By default this folder is at $HOME/.kde/share/autostart


Open a Konqueror window and browse to the program you want to add. If you don't know how to do this, it was covered in the section called “Opening a Window Containing Your Home Directory ”


Drag and drop the desired program from the Konqueror window on to the autostart folder. When asked, choose Link to create a symbolic link rather than a full copy, as this saves a great deal of disk space.


Repeat the above steps for every program you want started when KDE is launched. Remember, you don't need to add native KDE applications, just leave them open when you log out, and they will open up again as if nothing had happened, the next time you log in to KDE.


Restart KDE if you want to see the autostart function in action.


4. It should start using swap. I'd simply try it and see.

5. I don't think anyone has got SanDisk stuff to work in Linux. It's horrible, nasty, nasty stuff: it doesn't appear to be fully standards compliant. Try borrowing almost anything else. FWIW, I use a Zio reader which works fine with Maxwell and (opens camera) eFilm CF cards (and whatever comes as stock with Canon Ixus 3s.

[windos_no_thanks]

5. I don't think anyone has got SanDisk stuff to work in Linux. It's horrible, nasty, nasty stuff: it doesn't appear to be fully standards compliant. Try borrowing almost anything else. FWIW, I use a Zio reader which works fine with Maxwell and (opens camera) eFilm CF cards (and whatever comes as stock with Canon Ixus 3s.
Some people at http://www.qbik.ch/usb/devices/ have reported success with some of SanDisk's readers.
Cuddles: What is the usb ID of your reader ? (should be visible somewhere in /var/log/messages)

[Alexxx]

(2) After doing the apt-get upgrade from hell, I now show a 235.8 MEG device, named tmpfs, with a mount point of /dev/shm - where did this come from, and why? It currently shows no space usage, but what is it?

It's your shared memory!

Alessandro

[Cuddles]

Ok, I am going to respond to everyone in one reply, in order of there reply to my original post...

Fingers99
(a) as stated in my original post, the volume level has been changed, only thing it changes is the loudness of the sound, w/ the accompanying noise, turning down the volume on the "line in" just decreases the recorded sound w/ the noise, turning the volume up on the "line in" increases the recorded sound, and again, w/ the noise. Only time, and this is at any sound level, the noise is not heard, is during "silent" parts of the sound recording. Both Audacity, XMMS, and ReZound have the identical issues with this noise - until I got ALSA running, no noise was ever noted.

(b) KOOL - and from a manual too, I am impressed, never thought those things were of any use, unless you needed to level your monitor or something [giggle]

(c) So, the thinking is to absorb all my memory and then go after my swap space too - it better come back - or I'm running back to Windows [lol] - I'll give it a try - thanks.

(d) The stuff you tellin' me is greek, is all of that file systems that can be put into fstab? Or are they drivers, or programs???

Windos_No_Thanks
Is this what, or all, of what you are asking for?
scsi1 : SCSI emulation for USB Mass Storage devices
Vendor: SanDisk Model: ImageMate II Rev: 1.30
Type: Direct-Access ANSI SCSI revision: 02
Attached scsi removable disk sda at scsi1, channel 0, id 0, lun 0
SCSI device sda: 31361 512-byte hdwr sectors (16 MB)
sda: Write Protect is off
sda: sda1

What does a "usb ID" look like, give some examples...

Alexxx
Ok - I kinda guessed that from the mount point name used, but who put it their, and why? I have 512 meg of "physical" memory, and 500 meg of "swap" memory - isn't that "also" shared, why do I need this 235.8 meg [i]also]/i] shared as well? Get where I am coming from? Add insult to injury, not one BIT is being used in my SWAP, but something has to take away memory, kinda fishy to me. Hence, my interest in finding out why it is their, and who put it their. If it is benign, I just want to know that its all good - if it was something like a buffer when I was recording my sound files, I exited that program days ago, wouldn't something doing that, release its resources when it was closed down?

[windos_no_thanks]

Is this what, or all, of what you are asking for?
scsi1 : SCSI emulation for USB Mass Storage devices
Vendor: SanDisk Model: ImageMate II Rev: 1.30
Type: Direct-Access ANSI SCSI revision: 02
Attached scsi removable disk sda at scsi1, channel 0, id 0, lun 0
SCSI device sda: 31361 512-byte hdwr sectors (16 MB)
sda: Write Protect is off
sda: sda1

What does a "usb ID" look like, give some examples...


The info should have been a few lines earlier. This is what I get when I connect my cam, the stuff we want is in bold:

Mar 4 19:56:14 tuxbox kernel: hub.c: new USB device 00:03.2-1, assigned address 2
Mar 4 19:56:14 tuxbox kernel: usb.c: USB device 2 (vend/prod 0x4b0/0x104) is not claimed by any active driver.
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: Initializing USB Mass Storage driver...
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: usb.c: registered new driver usb-storage
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: scsi1 : SCSI emulation for USB Mass Storage devices
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: Vendor: NIKON Model: NIKON DSC E995 Rev: 1.00
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: Type: Direct-Access ANSI SCSI revision: 02
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: Attached scsi removable disk sda at scsi1, channel 0, id 0, lun 0
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: SCSI device sda: 1006992 512-byte hdwr sectors (516 MB)
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: sda: Write Protect is off
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: sda: sda1
Mar 4 19:56:20 tuxbox kernel: USB Mass Storage support registered.

[Cuddles]

I can't seem to locate a line that looks "similar" to that one, or even exact, nor does anything show up in BOLD either - or was that just for clarification for me to see it??

Here is everything from my Linux partition and starting of ext3 to that previous inforomation I gave you...

Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb.c: registered new driver usbdevfs
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb.c: registered new driver hub
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb-uhci.c: $Revision: 1.275 $ time 20:50:29 Oct 3 2003
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb-uhci.c: High bandwidth mode enabled
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: PCI: Found IRQ 5 for device 00:07.2
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:07.3
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb-uhci.c: USB UHCI at I/O 0xd400, IRQ 5
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb-uhci.c: Detected 2 ports
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb.c: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 1
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: hub.c: USB hub found
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: hub.c: 2 ports detected
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: PCI: Found IRQ 5 for device 00:07.3
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:07.2
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb-uhci.c: USB UHCI at I/O 0xd800, IRQ 5
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb-uhci.c: Detected 2 ports
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb.c: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 2
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: hub.c: USB hub found
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: hub.c: 2 ports detected
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb-uhci.c: v1.275:USB Universal Host Controller Interface driver
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: Initializing USB Mass Storage driver...
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb.c: registered new driver usb-storage
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: USB Mass Storage support registered.
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: Serial driver version 5.05c (2001-07-08) with MANY_PORTS SHARE_IRQ SERIAL_PCI ISAPNP enabled
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: ttyS00 at 0x03f8 (irq = 4) is a 16550A
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: ttyS01 at 0x02f8 (irq = 3) is a 16550A
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: hub.c: new USB device 00:07.2-2, assigned address 2
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: parport0: PC-style at 0x378 [PCSPP,EPP]
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: parport0: Printer, HEWLETT-PACKARD DESKJET 940C
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: parport_pc: Via 686A parallel port: io=0x378
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb-uhci.c: interrupt, status 2, frame# 665
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: NTFS driver v1.1.22 [Flags: R/W MODULE]
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: Linux agpgart interface v0.99 (c) Jeff Hartmann
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: agpgart: Maximum main memory to use for agp memory: 409M
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: agpgart: Detected Via Apollo Pro KT133 chipset
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: agpgart: AGP aperture is 64M @ 0xd8000000
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: SGI XFS snapshot 2.4.22-2003-09-03_04:09_UTC with ACLs, realtime, no debug enabled
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: SGI XFS Quota Management subsystem
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: EFS: 1.0a - http://aeschi.ch.eu.org/efs/
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: usb_control/bulk_msg: timeout
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: scsi1 : SCSI emulation for USB Mass Storage devices
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: Vendor: SanDisk Model: ImageMate II Rev: 1.30
Mar 4 09:28:59 Polaris kernel: Type: Direct-Access ANSI SCSI revision: 02

[fingers99]

(d) The stuff you tellin' me is greek, is all of that file systems that can be put into fstab? Or are they drivers, or programs???

You should have an entry in /etc/fstab something like:

/dev/sda1 /mnt/sda1 vfat noauto,users,exec,umask=000 0 0


for the card reader to work. (If it will work.)


FWIW, I use a Zio reader which works fine with Maxwell and (opens camera) eFilm CF cards (and whatever comes as stock with Canon Ixus 3s).

OK, Zio is a type of CF card reader made by microtech. (They're pretty common in Europe.) Maxwell and eFilm are 2 manufacturers of CF cards. The Canon Ixus 3 is a common make of digital camera which comes with CF cards.


Note that a mass storage device is not generally accessed in quite the same way as a CF card.

For the sound artefacts, you might try playing around with the gain. Otherwise, see what the Alsa folk have to say.

[windos_no_thanks]

I can't seem to locate a line that looks "similar" to that one, or even exact, nor does anything show up in BOLD either - or was that just for clarification for me to see it??

Yes, I set the interesting line to bold manually.
Maybe it doesn't always show up, perhaps you could try "lsusb -v" (as root) instead ?

[Cuddles]

Windos_No_Thanks
Here is the output from lsusb -v


Bus 002 Device 001: ID 0000:0000
Device Descriptor:
bLength 18
bDescriptorType 1
bcdUSB 1.00
bDeviceClass 9 Hub
bDeviceSubClass 0
bDeviceProtocol 0
bMaxPacketSize0 8
idVendor 0x0000
idProduct 0x0000
bcdDevice 0.00
iManufacturer 0
iProduct 2 USB UHCI Root Hub
iSerial 1 d800
bNumConfigurations 1
Configuration Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 2
wTotalLength 25
bNumInterfaces 1
bConfigurationValue 1
iConfiguration 0
bmAttributes 0x40
Self Powered
MaxPower 0mA
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 0
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 1
bInterfaceClass 9 Hub
bInterfaceSubClass 0
bInterfaceProtocol 0
iInterface 0
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x81 EP 1 IN
bmAttributes 3
Transfer Type Interrupt
Synch Type None
Usage Type Data
wMaxPacketSize 0x0008 bytes 8 once
bInterval 255

Bus 001 Device 001: ID 0000:0000
Device Descriptor:
bLength 18
bDescriptorType 1
bcdUSB 1.00
bDeviceClass 9 Hub
bDeviceSubClass 0
bDeviceProtocol 0
bMaxPacketSize0 8
idVendor 0x0000
idProduct 0x0000
bcdDevice 0.00
iManufacturer 0
iProduct 2 USB UHCI Root Hub
iSerial 1 d400
bNumConfigurations 1
Configuration Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 2
wTotalLength 25
bNumInterfaces 1
bConfigurationValue 1
iConfiguration 0
bmAttributes 0x40
Self Powered
MaxPower 0mA
Interface Descriptor:
bLength 9
bDescriptorType 4
bInterfaceNumber 0
bAlternateSetting 0
bNumEndpoints 1
bInterfaceClass 9 Hub
bInterfaceSubClass 0
bInterfaceProtocol 0
iInterface 0
Endpoint Descriptor:
bLength 7
bDescriptorType 5
bEndpointAddress 0x81 EP 1 IN
bmAttributes 3
Transfer Type Interrupt
Synch Type None
Usage Type Data
wMaxPacketSize 0x0008 bytes 8 once
bInterval 255

Fingers99
The entry I already have in fstab is this - note the only thing missing from yours is the "umask" part - would that cause my mount not to work???

# SanDisk USB - Canabalized - Added by KNOPPIX
/dev/sda /mnt/sda vfat defaults,user,noexec,noauto 0 0

I will make the "1" changes to the mount point, and the device part, and add the umask= part... Will post back on results...

Cuddles

[Cuddles]

O M G -=- My SanDisk works :!:

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you... :lol: (Cuddles is doing the Happy Dance now...

So far this is the completion of the "Shopping List", what is resolved, and what still remains...

(1) After -=-finally-=- getting ALSA to work on my system, whew, now I am having sound quality issues. No hardware was changed, wires, setups as far as how the hardware is set up, just ALSA vs the "default" installed sound from Knoppix.


(1) I can play an audio cd through XMMS and hear a low clicking noise that runs about every five seconds. Both Audacity and ReZound have this problem: I can play a external (line) input device audio, it sounds fine, I hit record, it appears to have recorded fine, until I play the recorded sound back, or save the sound to disk and play it back through any player, I get noise -=- like a static sound -=- that accompanies any sound. When the sound is silent, so is the noise, but as the sound gets louder, so too does the noise. I have tried different volume levels, and same result. What is the big deal with ALSA, I didn't have any of these problems with the "default" sound in Knoppix.
Not resolved.


(2) After doing the apt-get upgrade from hell, I now show a 235.8 MEG device, named tmpfs, with a mount point of /dev/shm - where did this come from, and why? It currently shows no space usage, but what is it?
Not resolved.


(3) How do you auto-start a program in a user login? Now that I have ALSA, I like to have the mixer up and viewable, but leaving AlsaMixerGUI just running when I log out, does not bring it back up when I re-login. So, how would I get it so that this "program" runs when my user logs in?
RESOLVED -=- Works perfectly -=- Thank you Fingers99


(4) ReZound - since I have been having so many problems with Audacity, a nice "feature" of getting ALSA running on my system is that ReZound NOW will let me record, as it wouldn't before. Problem is that it appears that ReZound likes to write to memory while you are recording, considering limited memory, and abundant hard disk free space, and the fact I am recording up to 50 minutes of continuous sound, memory could/will run out. Does anyone know a way to "point" ReZound to working on the hard drive, or a temp folder, instead of memory?
RESOLVED -=- Kind of -=- Let it blow memory (physical), and let it go to swap -=- Thank you, again, Fingers99


(5) Anyone ever work with a SanDisk Flash Reader (ImageMate II CompactFlash USB), connected to the USB, in Debian/Knoppix? What file system does it use? (ain't vfat thats for sure!)
RESOLVED -=- Works perfectly -=- Thank you to both Fingers99 and Windos_NoThanks

So far we are 3 of 5, can we get 100% :?:
Cuddles

[Cuddles]

(1) After -=-finally-=- getting ALSA to work on my system, whew, now I am having sound quality issues. No hardware was changed, wires, setups as far as how the hardware is set up, just ALSA vs the "default" installed sound from Knoppix.

I can play an audio cd through XMMS and hear a low clicking noise that runs about every five seconds. Both Audacity and ReZound have this problem: I can play a external (line) input device audio, it sounds fine, I hit record, it appears to have recorded fine, until I play the recorded sound back, or save the sound to disk and play it back through any player, I get noise -=- like a static sound -=- that accompanies any sound. When the sound is silent, so is the noise, but as the sound gets louder, so too does the noise. I have tried different volume levels, and same result. What is the big deal with ALSA, I didn't have any of these problems with the "default" sound in Knoppix.
To further assist the "debugging" of this issue, I have done the following tests:

While listening to Line, or Capture, through ALSA - which the audio sounds fine...
I have recorded with the following programs:
ReZound, Audacity, Sound-Recorder, and KRecorder.

When playing back this same "recorded" sound, which, while I was recording, sounded fine, now plays in the following programs, with an associated noise:
APlay, XMMS, ReZound, and Audacity.

Considering that I have the SAME problem with a multituide of recording programs, and using different players for the WAV files - and STILL have noise, when a recording is being made, is not their, I think this goes deeper than a "program" issue, or hardware, I think it has something to do with ALSA, because I "never" had this problem with the default sound system, and KMix, through Arts inside Linux.

Can someone please get my recording noiseless, I seriously need to do some business, and noise is one thing my customers (probably) will not tollerate.

Thanks for any, and all, assistance in resolution,
Cuddles

[fingers99]

You've got me.

If the Alsa folk can't suggest anything, my guess (seek wiser counsel!) is that you could go back to OSS.

In the meantime, you might want to look at this device:

http://www.neurosaudio.com/store/prod_neuros.asp

think of it as an ugly Ipod with a shedload more functionality.

I can't try it as I've no access to amplified line out from a tape deck, but one of these should be able to record straight to mp3 from a suitable analogue source or (don't tell your customers!) to mp3 from the microphone. You could then just snag the mp3s and burn (or edit and burn).

I got mine from the US for $190 or so (before Customs and Excise here slapped an extra 17.5% on). :x

[Cuddles]

Hmmmmmm,

Let's say I'm seriously pist-off at ALSA - to the point that I, one, am willing to scrub ALSA completely from my system, and return to OSS. Two, short of re-installing Knoppix from scratch - not an option - but, am willing to throw away almost two weeks of work trying to finally get ALSA working in the first place, to go back to OSS. Three, ALSA appears to be a form of "dreamware" as for quality recording without associated noise and static. Lastly, four, I appear to not be getting any "bites" from anyone in the ALSA Group, on finding a reesolve for this issue.

Now, lets take a summary count of the above: Out of a total of 4 qualifiers, I am currently looking at 3 3/4 of them being met - the 3/4 is from qualifier #4 - ALSA Group has only been brought into the picture of this problem for a little under a week now. Kind of a long time to be waiting for a reply, so I reposted my issue through channels a second time now.

Now, lets say, for arguement sake, I was at exactly "4" -=- How would one rip ALSA, and its introduction of non-existant "noise-free" recording rump, out of Knoppix, and get everything back to the way it was before all of this was done???

How about a compromise? Can ALSA "co-exist" with OSS, or arTs, at the same time? That would be a good compromise! I could use the arTs part for my recording, and ALSA for the playback, or something. ANYTHING to get a nice quiet recording, and get me on my way.

Thanks for any resolve one my List Entry #1 here. I think entry #2 I am just going to have to live with, since no one has any clues why I have to have shared memory "locked" as a device,
Cuddles

[fingers99]

I think this is the easy way to do it. Just pop open the Sys V init editor. (Kmenu > System > Sys V init editor) You'll be able to stop Alsa from starting. Reboot and see if one of the other sound servers takes over. If not, you may have to set it to start.

Doing it this way is, at least, non destructive. If all else fails, couldn't you do the capturing via the live CD and the editing and burning through the CD install?

[OErjan]

just one small thing. add the line noatime to your cf, flash... cards,
apparently they will otherwise be subjected to "unesesary" wear (yes they DO wear).
The noatime prevents acces timestamps on the files, not necesary for these devices.
my fstab entry looks like this
/dev/sda1 /mnt/pen vfat users,noatime,gid=users,umask=0002,iocharset=iso88 59-1 1 0
just something usefull i have found in a manual for a noname pendrive.

[Markus]

Got curious by the tmpfs thingy and googled around a bit.

Seems like tmpfs is needed for POSIX compliancy in linux.
The fact that it's not used by any programs at this time can only mean IMHO that they put it there to make porting programs between OS's easier, and that it might be used by future programs???
Ok, so I read that the shm_open function in glibc needs it, but what uses it? Anyone?
You could also try moving over your /tmp to a mount under tmpfs and see if things speed up.

You can do a "locate tmpfs.txt" to have a look, I have it under:
/usr/src/kernel-source-2.6.2/Documentation/filesystems/tmpfs.txt
/usr/share/doc/kernel-doc-2.4.24-xfs-fe-dm1/Documentation/filesystems/tmpfs.txt.gz

Some explanation:
http://www-106.ibm.com/developerworks/library/l-fs3.html

Ergo, it doesn't seem to do much harm (bit larger kernel & a little wasted RAM) but will probably be needed sometimes soon.