knoppix-installer: debian vs knoppix install? which one?

[torchZ06]

hi all,

here's my question:
in the 'knoppix-installer' tool, which install method is the best one to choose for a primary OS: the Debian one (like kpx-install) or the Knoppix one? i want to use it as an everyday system-- will be used for graphics and photo retouching and printing and web surfing. GF's computer

heres some background:
i'm pretty new to knoppix-- it was recommended to me by the guys over at the Gentoo forum-- i've been messing around with Gentoo for a while, but i need a more ready-to-run OS for my GF's computer and i don't want to mess with a mandrake or redhat. i never really spent the time to get debian figured out-- i downloaded the 7 CDs, but that was about as far as i got.

knoppix seemed like the best of both worlds-- you got a full-on debian system without all the hassle of setting it up!

so far i used the old kpx-install and the knoppix-installer tools, choosing "knoppix style" in the latter's Debian vs. Knoppix choice.

both seem to work fine, but i want to use the one that will give me the best system to grow with.

thanks for any input,
patrick

[m_yates]

Hi,

I installed on 3 PC's using the knoppix-installer and choosing a Debian system. It works great and once you learn how to use apt-get, you will never have to install again. On my desktop at home, I have upgraded KDE, installed Gnome, and upgraded the kernel. I used to run Mandrake, but I always re-installed about every 6 months because a new version would come out with upgraded Kernel, KDE, or Gnome. Debian allows you to easily make upgrades of any scale without re-installing the operating system.

I'm not familiar with the "Knoppix-style" install. Part of the reason I'm replying to this post is to see what others say about this. As I understood it, the "knoppix-style" goes through the hardware detection and configuration routine each time you boot, just like on the CD. I'm not sure if that is true, but I didn't want that because I needed to install Nvidia graphics and platform drivers.

[MattT]

The best explanation for why there is a "Knoppix-style" and "Debian-style" installer is in this post http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5017

Basically "Knoppix-style" is more in the spirit of the original concept of Knoppix (i.e. no manual hardware setup, no login, easy to remaster) while "Debian-style" is for those who want to use Knoppix as a means to set up a Debian system.

[torchZ06]

hey thanks for the feedback. i had just finished the "knoppix style' install when i posted but after playing with it, i think the 'debian style' is definitely the way to go. it seems to have the same menu's and stuff, but little things, like when you go to log out it acts just like the CD and shuts down the machine. it did seem to get the language right though because unlike the knx-install, i didn't have to mess with the locale n stuff.

[garfield-]

how to set knoppix after install "knoppix style" that it would be ask for user and password ?

[CrashedAgain]

>>but little things, like when you go to log out it acts just like the CD and shuts down the machine.

! How do you do this. Mine doesn't. I have installed knoppix on 3 boxes, versions 3.1,3.2&.3.3, tried knx-hdinstall on the older versions & both debian style & knoppix style with 3.3. It will power down my laptop but never powers down my desktop boxes. This is one of my pet peeves, I have been unsuccessful in finding the edits or settings to get the system to power down.

>>I'm guessing here but I think you would go to KDE control centre, 'boot options' or 'startup options' & uncheck 'automatically log on one user'.

>>The best explanation for why there is a "Knoppix-style" and "Debian-style" installer is in this post http://www.knoppix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5017

What is implied but not made clear in this post is that 'Knoppix style' will rebuild to default fstab & default hardware setup each boot. This is why I use 'Debian style' instead, Knoppix default sets my monitor at 60 cps flicker & I want my shared drives mounted differently. Also, once you are installed on HD, there is no need for all those alternative language supports so the first thing I do is apt-get update & install localepurge. I have found that sometimes when you log out/login again as new user the system does funny things like suddenly speaking German. I also remove the en-de version of Openoffice & install the full version. The en-de version that comes with Knoppix has no help files. Apt-get doesn't do a good job of this, download the tar file & use the built in installer instead. I have also had video bugs whcich I think I have found the solution to. See my other post for this one.

[torchZ06]

hi crashed,

i think i mislead you there- when i said it shuts the box down i meant when i logged out it switched to runlevel 0 and took me to the "...remove CD and hit Enter" prompt. never actually "powered off" the machine.

yea, i found out what the "knoppix style" install was all about. however, i had a slight problem with 'knoppix-installer' when i went to switch back over to "debian style" install. the first time i installed it to my hard drive i used "knx-install" and it prompted me to use CUPS and DHCP 'n all that. when i tried the 'knoppix-installer' it was nice and let me make new users, but it never set up the rest of the stuff like DHCP, CUPS, etc. is this normal? i ended up killing it and going back and using the 'knx-install' again.

trying to figure out the similarities and differences between 'apt' and 'emerge' is what i'm currently looking into. the debian style install has given me one helluva nice system with the least ammount of fuss i've ever put into ANY linux distro. two thumbs WAY UP to the knoppix guys on a great piece of work.

[jeramy]

With regards to powering off, my desktop *does* power off. As far as distributions go, it's either hit or miss. In Slackware it doesn't, but in Knoppix, it does.

It all depends, too, on the motherboard. MS was given access to the "proper" method of powering off by all the various manufacturers, which is why it works for them (unless Windows crashes). The Linux people have had to reverse-engineer it, so it doesn't work in all cases.

AFAICT, motherboards only use either APM, or ACPI. Don't quote me on that, though.
My motherboard (Asus K7V333) uses APM, which Knoppix happens to use, but when I try to run a kernel with ACPI, it'll hang my PC.

I noticed as well that in LILO (/etc/lilo.conf) there's an append flag (that I can't remember) that contains "apm" and "power-off".

[fastvfr]

Jeramy is correct.

If Knoppix doesn't like your version of APM, then it will just 1. drop you at RL2 prompt; 2. Tell you to remove the disk and hit Enter; or 3. do as mine does (with either a Knoppix of Debian style install, BTW) and end the session only, restart or shut 'er down.

I use an Asus P4C800-E Deluxe MOBO with the latest BIOS version, if it matters.

And yes, along with lang=us, nomce and such, there is a flag on each kernel for apm=power-off.

Best regards,

FastVFR