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Thread: ISO boot from FAT/NTFS/USB (GRUB.exe, grldr from boot.ini)

  1. #561
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    To be honest Gilles...

    This was my first thumbdrive. I 'struggled' with my buggy bios... so by the time I got that working... I was going for the most surefire way to get it working. By the time I was finished... I was pooped! Never picked it up again to make it any better. Now since 5.3.1 came out... I am really retructuring my drives. 5.1.1 is an old friend by now... damn hard to unglue it. Getting rid of all KNOPPIX/KNOPPIX style partitions and converting them to ntfs and iso. That is the only way I can see to run different versions btw. I never needed multiple versions of Knoppix till now. Gilles, if you have different flavors of Knoppix on a stick... then that would be a good reason to be running from iso. I was not aware grub4dos could boot from usbdrives. But having the iso on the stick is a good reason for me to fool with it again.

    jw113... If Gilles has the time... he is the one to listen to with your setup. I would have volunteered his name, but... when I saw those backslashes...

    I really wish there was a bugs page for Knoppix. I tried to use... home=/media/hdb10 and ya know what? I think in the script... it must grab one character for the partition number... because I kept getting an error tonight until I tried using home=/dev/hdb10/knoppix.img. The good news is I am using a copy of my persistent home from 5.1.1 with 5.3.1. I did have to remove the kernel modules and rebuild them for this version, but that is to be expected.

    I did wind up with a new user entry in /var/lib/dpkg/statoverride... somehow... which causes apt-get to fail... hplip root 755 /var/run/hplip and mostly all I can see on it is people from Ubuntu complaining about it using Google. I figure I will comment it out and try again.

    Best Regards,
    John

  2. #562
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    Sorry about the backslashes, but I'm using someone else's Syslinux.cfg and they used backslashes throughout (and they work). Hope they don't cause too much anxiety here

    I'm using Syslinux rather than GRUB because I'm adding Knoppix to an existing USB key that's already using Syslinux, and I thought it would be easier to add Knoppix to Syslinux than to redo the existing config in GRUB (which I know no better than Syslinux).

    After trying various combinations of paths, slashes, etc. and looking at earlier posts here for the ISO path, I did finally get my 5.1.1 ISO booting via Syslinux, using:
    Code:
    LABEL KNOPPIX
      MENU LABEL Launch Knoppix 5.11a
      KERNEL /knoppix.511/linux ramdisk_size=100000 init=/etc/init lang=us apm=power-off vga=791 nomce quiet bootfrom=/dev/sda1/knoppix.511/*.iso config=scan home=scan ramdisk=32768 noprompt noaudio
      APPEND initrd=/knoppix.511/mini511a.gz
      TEXT HELP
      Runs Knoppix 5.11a from ISO
      ENDTEXT
    The key to my problem seems to be that Syslinux can't find the minirt.gz file it it has a LFN. Using the original minirt_511a.gz didn't work (regardless of location), but renaming it to mini511a.gz worked fine (again regardless of location).

    Thanks!

  3. #563
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    USB boot from syslinux

    "...I'm using Syslinux rather than GRUB because I'm adding Knoppix to an existing USB key..."
    Hello,
    An other solution to solve your problem is to start grub from syslinux
    (with obviously a new boot option in your syslinux config file)
    since grub.exe is also a linux kernel (besides a dos program).
    Best Regards,
    Gilles

  4. #564
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    Re: USB boot from syslinux

    Quote Originally Posted by ruymbeke
    An other solution to solve your problem is to start grub from syslinux..."
    Thanks, I may give it a try (just for fun). I already have GRUB booting via NTLDR, but it didn't occur to me to do the same via Syslinux...

  5. #565
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    Ok... I decided to give it a try... to put the iso on instead.
    I now have it using Knoppix 5.1.1 and it's persistant home.

    sda1->vfat(128 MB) Yes my minirt_511a.gz is now also renamed to mini511a.gz... but I could have probably used minirt~1.gz in the syslinux.cfg. (The thought of those ~1 compromises on a linux box is sickening,)

    sda5->ext2(4400 MB as specified in fdisk creation) mkfs.ext2 -m 1 -L knoppix /dev/sda5 ( the -m 1 means to allocate only 1% for root. This partition is always mounted read-only anyways. Knoppix 5.3.1 is slightly larger so 4400 may not be enough.)

    sda6->got the rest of the space. 1.5 GB for knoppix.img and 1.5 GB for VirtualBox's virtual disk image. I also cut the root space to 1% for this partition but made sure the cheatcode noeject was not there to invoke the kernel. (To make sure the kernel is finished writing everything back to the drive before I press enter is a good thing. It was rebooting too quickly for my comfort)

    I had no luck being able to have the iso and knoppix.img on the same partition. The bootup would silently ignore any home= cheatcode... but would run knoppix.sh. It may be because my partitions were ext3. I gave up and decided to repartition everything into nice and neat separate partitions. But when I had used the fromhd=/dev/sda2 and home=/media/sda2 and sda2 was in fact a vfat partition... it did work. Does home=/media/someExt3Partition even work? I dunno. I got tired of rebooting.

    And so ends my messing with Knoppix on thumbdrives. Being able to start someone's pc from this, and show them Knoppix running XP in a window... and leaving no trace on their pc... makes a heck of a demo eh? You are right to stress how having the iso right there on the drive is better design.

    Cheers

    Hmmm... backslashes actually work? That's a big surprise.

  6. #566
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnrw
    ... The bootup would silently ignore any home= cheatcode... but would run knoppix.sh. It may be because my partitions were ext3...
    Hi John,
    I don't see why vfat would work better than ext. Probably a bug to fix...
    But why do you need a (separate) ext partition to hold your knoppix.img file ?
    (All linux attributes will be stored within the knoppix.img and you just wrote that vfat works)
    Vfat can be read from other OS to be copied and installed on other systems.
    My two cents,
    Gilles

    PS: I did the same demo quite a while ago patching at boot time VmWare workstation onto Knoppix 5.1.1.
    Running XP inside a VmWare virtual machine on a Knoppix 5.1.1 Linux host, all booted from a USB dongle.
    A tiny USM dongle in my wallet is a much better way to travel these days than carying a heavy laptop !

  7. #567
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    Hi Gilles,

    Yeah... the trouble with the knoppix bootup... is there is no way to start it in a debug mode that I know of. I guess that would need to be a special debug minirt. I spent too much time rebooting. So once I convinced myself it was not going to work... I decided to repartition and squeeze the partition holding the iso to the bare minimum. That way I could have the best shot at creating yet another partition for holding my knoppix.img and other stuff. I noticed that mkfs.ext2 sets aside %5 of the partition for root's use as a default option. Now that you have pointed out I won't be able to copy the sda5 partition (duh!) I will be reformating them to 1 big vfat. Then ntfs_rw. I noticed that on 5.3.1 I would get some udev spew about / partition being mounted read only... and I solved that with a ro on the kernel cmdline. But I am using 5.1.1 for this project... since it is now very compatible with Debian Etch. Even Google Desktop installed on that Knoppix.

    I knew you would have had a vmware solution... and I think I grabbed a vm of yours from vmware's site. That's on hold for the moment though. I got involved in this stuff because I needed to run a windows program 24/7... and XP is not up to that job. VirtualBox was so easy to be up and running, Next was just getting it all on a thumbdrive... Next...I could take a break. lol.

  8. #568
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    Gilles... did I ever mention I was using the dvd iso? Too big for fat32. (What a pain.)

    Ok... trying now for a bootable ntfs partition that holds the DVD iso. I got as far as making sda1 a bootable partition. I booted grub, and in turn booted the Knoppix dvd iso. Grub4dos complained about my mbr or partition table. It would throw the geometry up of what it thought it was. Since I am using the infamous Award buggy bios, well... buggy as far as bootable usb and thumbdrives goes... I needed to set the advanced bios options up a little differently. 1st boot drive=usb-fdd instead of usb zip drive, and then there was another option for usb style which has the choices Auto, usb-hdd, and usb-fdd. I set it to usb-hdd. Although grub4dos complained, it found the menu.lst, and booted it. It appears as though the bios was tricking grub4dos into believing the usb drive was hd0. So I get a little confused over the transition from the drive being hd0 to becoming sda for linux... but that is in the magic of it all.

    Since I had set the drive's geometry to 7648 cylinders, 64 heads and 32 sectors per track... a requirement for zip drive emulation... I figure that might be getting in the way of udb-hdd and maybe grub4dos saw some discrepancy. I also renamed GRLDR to NTLDR since NTLDR was named in sda1's boot record.

    This all worked to a point... I had to hit F3 to manually pick a boot drive. Auto detecting and booting of the thumbdrive didn't seem to work, I think that may be due to the drive's mbr code being insufficient and or the geometry being 32 sectors per track. I am going to try 63 sectors per track today... and see if I can figure out how to get a working mbr on it.

    I feel pretty good about my progress though. I made the ntfs partition using linux. Booted XP and it said the drive was healthy. I ran a check for errors and it didn't complain. (Probably phoned home to MS though lol) More later. Gilles, this thread may have the answer I need in it somewhere... it's a freakin book though. I am not interested in a fat 16 or 32 partition for holding grub4dos and loading the kernel that way at this point. I can do that easilly enough.

  9. #569
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    Whew!,

    I can say, I have a ntfs formatted bootable partition that holds the 4GB+ iso and grub4dos. Renaming grub4dos's GRLDR to NTLDR and a menu.lst that thinks it's rooted on hd0,0 but still specifying the iso being on sda1 in the bootfrom= cheatcode. This setup boots on my Via km400 based board with an Award bios, but not on a Via km266pro with an AMI 2005 bios. But hey, I've learned alot. Is there a short page Howto here somewhere on this?

  10. #570
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    Gilles,
    I am not sure if it is only in your minirt or in Klaus' also... but when I try and specify
    home=/media/hda5/knoppix511.img it fails to find it. Is the knoppix.img as a filename hardcoded into the mount script?
    I could swear I read somewhere I am supposed to be able to specify a complete filename in the home= cheatcode.

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