Remastering, removing KDE, starting X

[mack]

mikeypants,

Great Journal! Thanks for posting this.

I'll follow the same steps on my next remaster (probably in a few days) and post if I run into any additional problems. My customization is for totally different purposes so kicklist is different. This is good. The more people follow the same steps with different kicklists, the more dependecies and weird problems we'll get, and the faq will be more complete.

And I checked about your problem with everything running as root instead of knoppix. The package in charge of this is called xsession-initscript-knoppix. Specifically, the file /etc/init.d/xsession which you probably modified heavily since you cut down a lot of X/WM stuff, originally starts with 'USER=knoppix' and later the environment is started with 'su - $USER'.

I suggest you just look at the original file and do the same in your modified version.

btw, I understand you hardcoded a lot of things to /home/knoppix. This is probably a bad idea. The "right" way seems to be storing your configuration files in /etc/skel/ (and chown to root.root). 45xsession contains a list of files/directories to copy to the user's home upon init, and its easy to change the username there.

I'll keep looking around and let you know if I run into anything else.

Mack

[mack]

You know, this thread has given me an idea. I see alot of talented people here with the persistance to achieve a desired result and all for fun.

A few of us who have the time and are willing should get together and all come to agreement on a certain target, and work together at it. Uploading every night to CVS, and when you have 3-4 people all working toward a certain product it gets done quicker and everyone learns from the other. This is how the open sourced community works everywhere else, and alot of nice software for Linux has come to light in this manner.

Thats what we usually do.

What project did you have in mind ? (I'm not saying I have time for additional projects right now, but maybe others will).

[mikeypants]

Hey again mack,

And I checked about your problem with everything running as root instead of knoppix. The package in charge of this is called xsession-initscript-knoppix. Specifically, the file /etc/init.d/xsession which you probably modified heavily since you cut down a lot of X/WM stuff, originally starts with 'USER=knoppix' and later the environment is started with 'su - $USER'.

I suggest you just look at the original file and do the same in your modified version.

That's odd, as I've still kept the xsession-initscript-knoppix package. I'm sure something's come along as other packages were being removed, though. I haven't modified many scripts just yet, as I'm trying to save all script editing for the very end of the remaster, after I've gotten down to my target size of 50 MB. The only real script I've modified is knoppix-autoconfig, and I've added a ratpoisonrc, and both are those are just to test and make sure that X comes up.

Actually, nevermind the above about not knowing the reason - I think the problem might be from running "knoppix 2" to get into text-mode, and THEN I'm calling startx as root, thereby running everything as root! I don't think I've tried booting without that cheatcode, as I'm just making sure the system starts up, then that "startx" starts fluxbox without a problem, and then testing out "startx /usr/bin/ratpoison" to see if it works (which it has, I think, but my ratpoisonrc wasn't totally customized, and I didn't know which Ctrl-key combination opened a new window..oops).

I'm probably going to have to change that file anyways, along with some others, but, again, I'm planning on dealing with all of that later on. I will note my changes, though, so don't worry.

btw, I understand you hardcoded a lot of things to /home/knoppix. This is probably a bad idea. The "right" way seems to be storing your configuration files in /etc/skel/ (and chown to root.root). 45xsession contains a list of files/directories to copy to the user's home upon init, and its easy to change the username there.

That does sound like a better idea, at least for the config files. That way they'll get distributed to the user, whoever it may be (root or knoppix).

However, I'm still not sure what to do in the case of users, as I really don't care who runs everything. There's really going to be nothing at all open on the system to have it taken over (and it's read-only already), so I don't know if it matters whether or not root runs everything, or knoppix. At this rate, I'm planning on leaving everything the same, running everything as knoppix. If there's any other ideas for this, let me know.

The whole reason I kept things in /home/knoppix (on the JumpDrive) were:

1. If the emulators ever get an update, I won't have to remaster, only build the new version. This can be changed, though, as all of the emulators (except VisualBoyAdvance) receive very sporadic updates, if any at all. I wouldn't mind re-mastering for them. I could even keep a copy of the system on my hard disk, since it would be small enough, so I could compile the new emu, copy over, and remaster. Also, if I do remove these, I could install DGen, Stella, and ZSNES in package form. I don't know which way takes up less space, though, and that's what the final decision would probably come down to.

2. If any changes need to be made to my Perl script, I could do it whenever I want under any Linux system (my desktop Gentoo or any version of Knoppix). Again, though, the script might be able to be placed somewhere else in the filesystem, provided it works completely fine and doesn't need any changes (which, at this point, it almost does, so it might not need to be updated ever).

3. The select ROMs I have on the JumpDrive can be changed whenever I'd like. I need to look into all of that anyways, with my scp idea.

4. I also have a script which I use to load up the joystick driver. I run this manually, but would like to make it automatic (which shouldn't be a big deal to place the module in /etc/modules.conf). I also don't think there would be a major problem if I autoload them and the user doesn't have a joystick. This will be looked into later on as well.

5. The persistent home feature just seemed too cool not to use. Plus, it gets mounted on boot, provided I pass the cheatcode to Knoppix, which I was planning on hardcoding in anyways. I don't think it would be a big deal, as I've tried passing the option before, and realizing my JumpDrive wasn't connected, and it just gives a minor error about not finding /dev/sda1 and continues booting. So, if the user didn't have a JumpDrive, they wouldn't have to worry about anything.

Ahh..thoughts are occuring way too fast in my head. I could probably find a place to put a /roms folder in the filesystem, and maybe release the entire system in the same way Knoppixmame and AdvanceCD were released - "here's the system, you put the ROMs in". That way, if I want to, I could keep at least part of my setup, which would only really be ROMs on the JumpDrive that could be changed whenever I want, and the fact that it's still a business card-sized CD (for me). If others want to load up the CD with ROMs and then burn it, they could use a regular 700 MB CD-R or RW. I would also have to make a special script somewhere for my scp-ing ROMs from my server, as I wouldn't want the world grabbing stuff off of me.

This is very cool. If I can get off of the whole "relying on the JumpDrive" mindset I'm in, I could probably release this to the world. Wow, that's a neat concept

As for remastering, I'm still at the point where I'm still trying to figure what else to rip out. I might copy Damn Small Linux over to see what he's removed, and if I can get any other ideas from it. I'm not done yet at all, I just need to get back into the groove after the weekend, and start removing more packages and testing. Again, any changes will be posted to the log.

Anyways, I've got to get back to work. Unfortunately I mean real work, not playing with Knoppix. I'll hopefully get some time to play later on, and I'll post everything on the log.

You know, this thread has given me an idea. I see alot of talented people here with the persistance to achieve a desired result and all for fun.

A few of us who have the time and are willing should get together and all come to agreement on a certain target, and work together at it. Uploading every night to CVS, and when you have 3-4 people all working toward a certain product it gets done quicker and everyone learns from the other. This is how the open sourced community works everywhere else, and alot of nice software for Linux has come to light in this manner.

Thats what we usually do.

What project did you have in mind ? (I'm not saying I have time for additional projects right now, but maybe others will).

I also agree with mack here too. I'd love to work on a project, but it never seems like I have enough time on my hands to work on it. I'm surprised I've had enough time to work on my remastering here. Although I would be interested to see if you had any specific project in mind as well.

[mack]

Actually, nevermind the above about not knowing the reason - I think the problem might be from running "knoppix 2" to get into text-mode, and THEN I'm calling startx as root, thereby running everything as root! I don't think I've tried booting without that cheatcode, as I'm just making sure the system starts up, then that "startx" starts fluxbox without a problem, and then testing out "startx /usr/bin/ratpoison" to see if it works (which it has, I think, but my ratpoisonrc wasn't totally customized, and I didn't know which Ctrl-key combination opened a new window..oops).

Yes, thats the problem. xsession only runs from the runlevel that starts X, so when you "knoppix 2" - start at runlevel2, xsession is never executed and the user is never switched. Furthermore, 45xsession is also not executed, so /etc/skel/* isn't copied to ~knoppix. If you plan to work from runlevel2, you'll need to add some stuff to your scripts, but I suggest you modify runlevel3 instead, and leave runlevel2 as text-only, for solving problems.

Anyways, I've got to get back to work. Unfortunately I mean real work, not playing with Knoppix. I'll hopefully get some time to play later on, and I'll post everything on the log.

hehe, I know the feeling.
Good luck.

and btw, I like the scp approach. I've used similar things in some project I designed, although I didn't scp because port 22 is sometimes blocked and I wanted something that works everywhere. Instead, I just wget the stuff off some web server (which can be done from just about anywhere, at least via proxies). The files on the web server are GPG'ed so everything is encrypted and signed. I don't even have to trust the web server I use, since I can verify my own signature when running from the CD.

[IllegalOperation]

I don't have any projects in mind either heh. Time is not on my side either really. Looks like there are a whole lot of roll your owns popping up every day, each with their own personality. Only if there was a group of people who needed something in specific would I approach it, and I would involve others who wished to participate.

I did work for quite awhile installing Gnome with Nautilus on a stripped core, this proved to be semi difficult and Nautilus never did work correctly. Then I found a post by Klause in the newsgroup saying he had problems with Gnome so he added Ice. I left it on the shelf for now.

[mikeypants]

and btw, I like the scp approach. I've used similar things in some project I designed, although I didn't scp because port 22 is sometimes blocked and I wanted something that works everywhere. Instead, I just wget the stuff off some web server (which can be done from just about anywhere, at least via proxies). The files on the web server are GPG'ed so everything is encrypted and signed. I don't even have to trust the web server I use, since I can verify my own signature when running from the CD.

mack,

That sounds like a great idea as well. I'll try keeping that in mind if the scp idea doesn't work out for some reason.

As for the remaster, I've hit a goldmine - Java left its 52 MB library installed. I'm now down to 53.2 MB. W00t!

Besides that, SourceForge rejected my idea for a project, but I guess I can't totally blame them as there's not too much that's new and fancy for a new distribution project there.

So, I've created a site to follow the project, which is now named TuxStation. You can find it here:

http://dev.tonydanzabonanza.com/tuxstation/

It (as usual) is a work in progress, which I'll be cleaning up ASAP.