klik: point-and-klik software store for Knoppix

[probono]

http://zero-install.sourceforge.net/

Sounds extremely interesting, but you have to recompile the kernel and use rox.

[antenna]

Sounds extremely interesting, but you have to recompile the kernel and use rox.

Yes, the kernel module is a bit off-putting, but I don't think that you have to use rox.

Your solution seems much simpler, but limited to one distribution and DE. Not that there's anything wrong with that. The zero-install system seems a little less narrowly focused, at the expense of installation complexity.

I think that both solutions are wonderful explorations of new ideas, and my hat is off to you.

What seems most similar to me about both projects is the use of AppDirs. Do you use a similar format to the rox AppDirs?

[probono]

What seems most similar to me about both projects is the use of AppDirs. Do you use a similar format to the rox AppDirs?

This would be a good idea indeed, so we should examine their AppFolder format. I am so terribly bad at recompiling kernels however that I will have to see how I can get a working installation of Zeroinstall. In principle, it should be even possible to combine klik and Zeroinstall, i. e. use a klik recipe that calls Zeroinstall "behind the scenes".

[antenna]

This would be a good idea indeed, so we should examine their AppFolder format.

There's some info here:
http://rox.sourceforge.net/phpwiki/index.php/AppDir

In principle, it should be even possible to combine klik and Zeroinstall, i. e. use a klik recipe that calls Zeroinstall "behind the scenes".

Yeah, and then you have the benefit of installing apps from a URL, which is something that zero install doesn't seem to have at the moment.

This stuff is so cool.

[kwadroke]

Does klik work with KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-19 or just KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-14? I tried adding klik to my remaster (based off of KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-19) and was able to install using "wget klik.berlios.de/client/install -O -|sh" but was unable to get any apps to 'install'.

Also, how about a dialog box that would ask if you wanted to Reinstall if you ran the "wget klik.berlios.de/client/install -O -|sh" if it found to be already installed.
A 'wizard' for creating your own recipes would be nice (in PHP or bash/kdialog, or whatever). It should help get more recipes out quicker, for basic programs, of course.

[xav]

Does klik work with KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-19 or just KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-14? I tried adding klik to my remaster (based off of KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-19) and was able to install using "wget klik.berlios.de/client/install -O -|sh" but was unable to get any apps to 'install'.

I had the same problem with a stock KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-19 download. Personally I would like to see a dialogue that informs you that your Knoppix version does not match, rather than just doing nothing at all. Preferably it would also have an option to try anyway, ignoring the difference in version numbers - because I'm sure that Knoppix can't have changed so much between -11-14 and -11-19 that most of the recipes wouldn't work.

[probono]

Does klik work with KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-19

It should. I didn't really test it, though.

I tried adding klik to my remaster (based off of KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-19) and was able to install using "wget klik.berlios.de/client/install -O -|sh" but was unable to get any apps to 'install'.

What happens if you run your remaster and *then* install the klik client as needed? This is the preferred method since the client itself is subject to frequent upgrades - then you would have to remaster again.

Also, how about a dialog box that would ask if you wanted to Reinstall if you ran the "wget klik.berlios.de/client/install -O -|sh" if it found to be already installed.

Not really neccessary since a reinstall of the client always does an update. It's just a few KBs, though

A 'wizard' for creating your own recipes would be nice (in PHP or bash/kdialog, or whatever). It should help get more recipes out quicker, for basic programs, of course.

This idea also came to my mind. We can even go one step further: Eventually it could be possible (for KDE applications I already know how to do it but not for others) to have a fully-automated online server-side recipe generator using the debian repositories. The end user wouldn't need to notice the on-the-fly-recipe-generation at all. All apt-get database querying stuff would run server-side, so it would not be neccessary to mess around with apt-get on the client side. I will come back to this idea once I also have a method for gtk apps and others.

[probono]

I had the same problem with a stock KNOPPIX_V3.3-2003-11-19 download. Personally I would like to see a dialogue that informs you that your Knoppix version does not match, rather than just doing nothing at all.

Well, it *does* try to install even version do not match. You can try to run ~/AppFolder/wrapper from the console to see what goes wrong. Eventually, you are able to fix it for your version then.

Currently my main goal is to find out what works where and what not, so I don't want be too restrictive when it comes to versions. As things mature, of course we should add a warning as you suggested. Additionally, there are the "user comments" on the store where you can report how it went with your version. This kind of user feedback could be integrated automatically into the recipe generator in the future.

[xav]

Currently my main goal is to find out what works where and what not, so I don't want be too restrictive when it comes to versions. As things mature, of course we should add a warning as you suggested.

I think some sort of warning would be a good idea to implement sooner rather than later. I spent quite some time last night installing and reinstalling the KliK software and trying to get several different recipes (in case there was a problem with a particular recipe). It took me some time to realise that my problem was probably just due to the Knoppix version I was using. I don't mind having wasted a bit of time on this, but someone else might just assume that the system is broken and dismiss it too easily. At least a warning would let them know that if it doesn't work, there is a reason why.

[kwadroke]

What happens if you run your remaster and *then* install the klik client as needed? This is the preferred method since the client itself is subject to frequent upgrades - then you would have to remaster again.

Actually I just have an icon on the desktop for the "wget klik.berlios.de/client/install -O -|sh" command, so if a new version of the script is on the server, it will grab it. I have also tried running it from konsole with the same results. The program installs & brings up the application window, but when I click on the program to 'install' and nothing happens. I did do a 'apt-get upgrade' on my remaster so something may have broke.
As far as my "Wizard" idea goes, I got off my lazy butt & started creating a php script to do this. It's nowhere near working yet, but I am working on it.