confused by password stuff

I did a full install of 6.2.1 from DVD to an unused 8GB SD drive using the "install to flash drive" utility from a live boot. All seems well, but I keep running afoul of the need for user "knoppix" to have a password. I was able to temporarily fix that by making user "knoppix" part of the "root" group - but nothing (not even ice weasel settings) get saved between boots. Shouldn't that all be saved in /home/knoppix? Has this been changed in Knoppix so that all settings go to that special settings file it gives me the option to create at boot time?

THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!!
:confused:Patti:-D

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Originally Posted by PattiMichell

I did a full install of 6.2.1 from DVD to an unused 8GB SD drive using the "install to flash drive" utility from a live boot. All seems well, but I keep running afoul of the need for user "knoppix" to have a password. I was able to temporarily fix that by making user "knoppix" part of the "root" group - but nothing (not even ice weasel settings) get saved between boots. Shouldn't that all be saved in /home/knoppix? Has this been changed in Knoppix so that all settings go to that special settings file it gives me the option to create at boot time?

THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!!
:confused:Patti:-D

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Great! AFAICT, "that special settings file" you refer to is the "persistent store", which is indeed where all changes you make would persist. However, you shouldn't have to make the changes you refer to in order to run Knoppix - it's designed to run without passwords. You can run anything you like as root, just by prefixing the command with "sudo". My suggestion is to try again, wiping and reinstalling, then boot it up and create a persistent store file, maybe 1-2 GB? That way you'll be able install most any program, etc.

Cheers!
Krishna :mrgreen:

"it's designed to run without passwords" - right, but the problem is more complicated than that, for instance, if you use the menu system to start the "Users and Groups" applet, it won't let you change anything. So I edited the menu entry to put "sudo" in front of the command line for the applet and it works fine. But these menu changes don't persist, so I guess I need to use that persistence file? Since it's installed on an 8GB SD drive, and it claims there is 4 Gig left, how big should I make the persistence file? I guess since Knoppix uses FAT32 - the biggest I can make it is ~2GB...

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Originally Posted by PattiMichell

"it's designed to run without passwords" - right, but the problem is more complicated than that, for instance, if you use the menu system to start the "Users and Groups" applet, it won't let you change anything. So I edited the menu entry to put "sudo" in front of the command line for the applet and it works fine. But these menu changes don't persist, so I guess I need to use that persistence file? Since it's installed on an 8GB SD drive, and it claims there is 4 Gig left, how big should I make the persistence file? I guess since Knoppix uses FAT32 - the biggest I can make it is ~2GB...

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I think that's probably FAT-Ex, M$oft's newer offering (which apparently has been adopted by flash device makers.) There seems to be no FS-related difficulty with large files on my 8GB USB-stick, but I used 2GB for that persistent store anyway, to leave room for both the 4GB KNOPPIX file/folder and some (Windows-accessible) unused FAT space. Knoppix itself can be installed on many if not most FSs, FWIW.

Cheers again!
Krishna :mrgreen:

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Originally Posted by krishna.murphy

I think that's probably FAT-Ex, M$oft's newer offering (which apparently has been adopted by flash device makers.) There seems to be no FS-related difficulty with large files on my 8GB USB-stick, but I used 2GB for that persistent store anyway, to leave room for both the 4GB KNOPPIX file/folder and some (Windows-accessible) unused FAT space. Knoppix itself can be installed on many if not most FSs, FWIW.

Cheers again!
Krishna :mrgreen:

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Hmmm... didn't think I needed to do a persistent store since I have a dedicated SD drive to knoppix. So I gave it a file size during boot in the option to make a persistent settings store file, but it didn't do anything... Should I just create a new user (me)?

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Originally Posted by PattiMichell

Hmmm... didn't think I needed to do a persistent store since I have a dedicated SD drive to knoppix. So I gave it a file size during boot in the option to make a persistent settings store file, but it didn't do anything... Should I just create a new user (me)?

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It's a fairly subtle thing - you might have missed it. It should create an encrypted file called knoppix-data.aes in the KNOPPIX folder on the SD card, in this case. The next time you boot, it should prompt you for the password you set for that file, then integrate everything inside with the file system you get when it's not there to create the effect of "changeability" without having to allow anything to actually change in the base install file.

Cheers!
Krishna :mrgreen:

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Originally Posted by PattiMichell

I guess since Knoppix uses FAT32 - the biggest I can make it is ~2GB...

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If your flash device uses FAT32 then your maximum size of single file is 4 GB.

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Originally Posted by PattiMichell

So I gave it a file size during boot in the option to make a persistent settings store file

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You have to enter only the integer. The size of the persistent image file is calculated in chunks with a size of 1 MB. Example: If you want to use a persistent image file with a size of 4000 MB then you must enter 4000.

Maybe I forgot to request an encrypted install when I did the to-SD install applet in the Live DVD? I don't remember seeing anything in the applet for a default home either. Maybe I have to do that manually still (even though there's an applet)?

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Originally Posted by klaus2008

If your flash device uses FAT32 then your maximum size of single file is 4 GB.

You have to enter only the integer. The size of the persistent image file is calculated in chunks with a size of 1 MB. Example: If you want to use a persistent image file with a size of 4000 MB then you must enter 4000.

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Maybe that's my problem!! I put "2000 MB" since the example shows the "MB" - I'll try again... Does the user always stay "knoppix" or do I create a user "patti" like in other distros?

Ah, got it! During the boot when you specify a size for the persistent file (sans the "MB" I was mistakenly appending), then it asks if you want to encrypt it... THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by PattiMichell

Maybe that's my problem!! I put "2000 MB" since the example shows the "MB" - I'll try again... Does the user always stay "knoppix" or do I create a user "patti" like in other distros?

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It's the conventional wisdom that Knoppix has been extensively customized (from the base distro, Debian) for use as a single-user LiveCD. Persistence has been added recently, which could allow for multiple users, but the heavy customization more-or-less precludes that. It's pretty easy to boot to the SD-Knoppix on most any "modern" system, making it a very portable little "system on a card"; if you need to install something else on your home system with multiple-user capability for others in your home (for instance) that wouldn't stop you booting it there too.

Cheers!
Krishna :mrgreen:
p.s. I'm imagining a multi-user version of Knoppix that works by allowing for the existence of multiple knoppix-data files. I can "emulate" that now (crudely) by renaming the one that's on my flash drive and creating another, which has all-different customization and private files. The downside of this crude approach is that there's a bunch of stuff I added to the SYSTEM (Google Chrome, etc.) that will "stick to" my original k-data file. There are numerous potential advantages (and disadvantages) to using something like this approach, I think.

Thanks, so, when installing new software in Knoppix, the executables, libraries, etc. that I install go into the "/" file system, and only personal settings are stored in the persistent file - is that true?

If not, all those files/libraries/executables will fill up the persistent file really fast!

I was looking at the Debian repos and there is a TON of cool software there that isn't in OpenSuSE repos (the other distro I use). So I guess I'll do a permanent install and put it into GRUB. I don't want to do pure Debian because Knoppix has the hardware detection I need for my laptop.

If you do an install to a flash drive I believe you do not have a full install. You have a 'poor man's install' where the Knoppix file, kernel and minirt file are copied across. These files cannot change so any changes, be they data, additional programs or program settings are stored to the persistent file.

(see http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/knoppix62-en.html note 6)

With this approach your worry about potentially running out of space if you install lots of apps is perfectly valid so you would need to create an appropriately sized persistent file.

If you do a full install to hard drive/flash drive then you should have a full knoppix file system (not just three files) and a persistent file is not needed. Additional programs will now go to the knoppix file system. However, this is not the recommended installation method (see note 6 again) although some do it.

Thanks - this makes sense. Now I'm deliberating on exactly what kind of install to do. I also tried desktop=kde but LXDE still comes up.