GRUB4DOS 0.4.4 + Knoppix 6.4.4 boot problems

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06-26-2011, 12:15 AM
KnUser

GRUB4DOS 0.4.4 + Knoppix 6.4.4 boot problems

• Media: 8GB SDHC Class 10
• File System: NTFS 3.01
• Root File(s):

/boot.ini
/grldr
/menu.lst
/ntldr

• Root Folder(s):

/ISO

• Boot Environment: GRUB4DOS 0.4.4 - 2009-06-20
• Affected Line(s) @ menu.lst:

title Lanzar CDVivo (LiveCD) de Knoppix v6.4.4 [en-US]\nú Equivalente a iniciar el equipo con el CDVivo (LiveCD) de Knoppix v6.4.4\n (Linux Kernel 2.6.37) | A¤o 2011.
find --set-root /ISO/KNOPPIX644CD.ISO
map /ISO/KNOPPIX644CD.ISO (0xff) || map --mem /ISO/KNOPPIX644CD.ISO (0xff)
map --hook
chainloader (0xff)

title Lanzar DVDVivo (LiveDVD) de Knoppix v6.4.4 [en-US]\nú Equivalente a iniciar el equipo con el DVDVivo (LiveDVD) de Knoppix v6.4.4\n (Linux Kernel 2.6.37) | A¤o 2011.
find --set-root /ISO/KNOPPIX644DVD.ISO
map /ISO/KNOPPIX644DVD.ISO (0xff) || map --mem /ISO/KNOPPIX644DVD.ISO (0xff)
map --hook
chainloader (0xff)

Note 1: 'ú' char at line start (\n) corresponds to symbol '·' Windows C_1252.NLS Western European codepage.
Note 2: '¤' char in word 'A¤o' corresponds to letter 'ñ' Windows C_1252.NLS Western European codepage.
Note 3: Año [ES] == Year [EN] == Jahr [DE].

• Affected File(s) @ Media:

/ISO/KNOPPIX644CD.ISO /* KNOPPIX_V6.4.4CD-2011-01-30-EN.iso - MD5: 99148dae9cc6e7dcf9bc8d0e157c564e */
/ISO/KNOPPIX644DVD.ISO /* KNOPPIX_V6.4.4DVD-2011-01-30-EN.iso - MD5: f9242b557cda9362ce361bb2e4b3a995 */

Problem description:
GRUB4DOS 0.4.4 correctly launches both disc images (KNOPPIX644CD.ISO and KNOPPIX644DVD.ISO) and Knoppix 6.4.4 correctly shows startup logo with prompt, but after pressing 'Enter' or wait for autoboot it takes several rounds/loops of "Waiting (USB)..." / "Searching for Knoppix in: ..." and then halts.

Also, Knoppix's 6.4.4 Linux Kernel 2.6.37 only detects 3039 MB RAM in my correctly configured 4GB system (both post messages and Windows 7 Enterprise x64 RTM Build 7600 detects and/or uses 4GB RAM).

Any ideas on how to solve boot problem and misdetection of RAM?

P.D.: In case it helps, several Acronis and Paragon ISO disc images in the same media are launched and booted correctly.

Thanks In Advance.
06-27-2011, 11:22 AM
Capricorny

I don't know grub4dos at all, but..
First memory: 3GB is limit with 32-bits. Run Knoppix with the 64-bits option (cheat code knoppix64) and all memory will be reported and used.
Then Knoppix: Are you sure this should work? I think the problem may be in your sequence of commands - what are you really telling the Knoppix bootloader here?
Clearly, the Knoppix boot is searching for a loadable image, and doesn't find any. There is a cheat code for this type of booting, from 6.4.4 cheat code list:

Code:

knoppix bootfrom=/dev/sda1/KNX.iso Access image, boot from ISO-Image.

I would have tried setting up an ordinary grub entry, like I give an example of here: http://www.knoppix.net/forum/threads...e-from-scratch
with the bootfrom option used in the kernel line.
06-27-2011, 12:07 PM
kl522

Quote:

Originally Posted by KnUser

Also, Knoppix's 6.4.4 Linux Kernel 2.6.37 only detects 3039 MB RAM in my correctly configured 4GB system (both post messages and Windows 7 Enterprise x64 RTM Build 7600 detects and/or uses 4GB RAM).

If what you tested is correct, meaning there is a problem with the kernel config for 32 bit of Knoppix. It's not easily to fix this yourself, you will have to probably ask Klaus Knopper to fix it. I am using my custom 32 bit kernel with Knoppix, it is able to detect the full 4G of memory which I have on my notebook.

I have poor man install on NTFS. I am using grub4dos. You are putting the entire ISO on the NTFS - here it is the difference.

Here is my menu.lst :-

Code:

# Comments # color black/cyan yellow/cyan timeout=5 default=0 title Knoppix on Internal HD (squashfs, normal) kernel /boot/syslinux/linux squashfs i915.modeset=1 lang=us nosound nomce loglevel=0 quiet noeject initrd /boot/syslinux/minirt.nowear.gz boot title Knoppix on Internal HD (squashfs, testing) kernel /boot/syslinux/linux video=vga16:off drm_kms_helper.poll=0 squashfs lang=us apm=power-off nosound nomce loglevel=0 quiet dma noeject initrd /boot/syslinux/minirt.gz boot
06-27-2011, 06:05 PM
KnUser

GRUB4DOS 0.4.4 + Knoppix 6.4.4 solving boot problems
Quote:

Originally Posted by Capricorny

I don't know grub4dos at all, but..
First memory: 3GB is limit with 32-bits. Run Knoppix with the 64-bits option (cheat code knoppix64) and all memory will be reported and used.

Thank you Capricorny, you're right 3GB is a natural 32-bit computing limit (without memory mapping tricks and so, quite time ago I've barely remember to read elsewhere that old Windows server editions had a special memory remapping mode to address more than 3GB but less than 4GB RAM in 32-bit enviroment) your suggestion on the cheat code was very helpful resulting in the following change:

Linux Kernel 2.6.37, 3039 MB RAM ==[TO]==> Linux Kernel 2.6.37-64, 3960 MB RAM
A whopping 921 MB RAM detection and/or usage increase.
Please note that differences are emphasized in underlined bold.

It seems GRUB4DOS 0.4.4, Linux Kernel 2.6.37 (32b) or any other component takes 33 MB RAM in 32-bit mode for booting purposes, 3039MB+33MB==3072MB (3GB) and 136 MB RAM in 64-bit mode, 3960MB+136MB==4096MB (4GB).

Quote:

Originally Posted by kl522

I am using my custom 32 bit kernel with Knoppix, it is able to detect the full 4G of memory which I have on my notebook.

Yes kl522, customization is a key factor to do more with less.

One of my next moves with Knoppix 6.4.4 is to modify the ISO to change german.kbd with an old spanish.kbd file so Spanish is loaded witout typing (as in a little-customized by me Knoppix 6.2.1 ISO):
- knoppix lang=es
- knoppix keyboard=es xkeyboard=es
Also I'll study what I did time ago with a Knoppix 6.2.1 ISO because I think it booted the way I wish.

I hope that by customizing/modifying the isolinux boot parameters inside the ISO Knoppix 6.4.4 could be launched from a pendrive/memory card from GRUB4DOS by loading an ISO file because I find very convenient to have a few files in root directory an a directory with a bunch of ISO files that you can fire up from a menu list, I think it is clean and contained.

Again, Thanks All
06-28-2011, 08:46 AM
fluolioff

gantt chart

The net table control is the successor to the v1.x DataGrid, adding the ability to take advantage of specific capabilities of ASP.NET data source controls. Whereas the v1.x datagrid net required a page developer to write custom code to handle simple operations such as paging, sorting, editing or deleting data, the GridView control can automatically handle these operations provided its bound data table html source control supports these capabilities. The GridView also offers some functionality improvements over the DataGrid, such as the ability to define multiple primary key fields, and some UI customization improvements, such as new field types and templating options. It also exposes a new model for page developers to handle or cancel events.

In the preceding example, the GridView control reflected against the fields of the data records returned by SqlDataSource in order to dynamically generate the columns of the grid. You can data grid also specify explicit column fields to display by adding DataControlField objects to the GridView's Columns collection. This allows you to specify exactly which columns to display and their relative order. The following example demonstrates a collection of BoundField and CheckBoxField objects in the net grid collection. Other field types that can be assigned to this collection are ImageField, HyperLinkField, CommandField, ButtonField, and TemplateField.
06-28-2011, 01:48 PM
KnUser

WHAT?!?!?!

Quote:

Originally Posted by fluolioff

The net table control is the successor to the v1.x DataGrid, adding the ability to take advantage of specific capabilities of ASP.NET data source controls. Whereas the v1.x datagrid net required a page developer to write custom code to handle simple operations such as paging, sorting, editing or deleting data, the GridView control can automatically handle these operations provided its bound data table html source control supports these capabilities. The GridView also offers some functionality improvements over the DataGrid, such as the ability to define multiple primary key fields, and some UI customization improvements, such as new field types and templating options. It also exposes a new model for page developers to handle or cancel events.

In the preceding example, the GridView control reflected against the fields of the data records returned by SqlDataSource in order to dynamically generate the columns of the grid. You can data grid also specify explicit column fields to display by adding DataControlField objects to the GridView's Columns collection. This allows you to specify exactly which columns to display and their relative order. The following example demonstrates a collection of BoundField and CheckBoxField objects in the net grid collection. Other field types that can be assigned to this collection are ImageField, HyperLinkField, CommandField, ButtonField, and TemplateField.

WHAT?!?!?!

NONE OF WHAT YOU SAID fluolioff HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS THREAD.

This thread is about GRUB4DOS 0.4.4 + Knoppix 6.4.4 boot problems not ASP.NET and related products.
ASP.NET is a proprietary programming technology by Microsoft Corp. that has nothing to do with opensource projects as GRUB4DOS and Linuxes (Knoppix as an example).

I think that jail post office (we-read-the-letters-before-giving-them-to-prisoners) system failed this time so please admin, try to rescue my 0627 answer to both Capricorny and kl522 and put it the place of this one from fluolioff. In it I thanked both Capricorny and kl522 and outlined my next move(s).

Sorry Capricorny and kl522, for any unknown reason my yesterday (20110627) response has not been published and, in its place, has been published the ASP.NET post by someone nicked fluolioff.
06-28-2011, 09:05 PM
KnUser

Thanks

Thank you Admin for recovering my 20110627 response post on this thread to Capricorny and kl522 forum users.
06-28-2011, 11:59 PM
kl522

Quote:

Originally Posted by KnUser

It seems GRUB4DOS 0.4.4, Linux Kernel 2.6.37 (32b) or any other component takes 33 MB RAM in 32-bit mode for booting purposes, 3039MB+33MB==3072MB (3GB) and 136 MB RAM in 64-bit mode, 3960MB+136MB==4096MB (4GB).
Yes kl522, customization is a key factor to do more with less.

Detecting 3039 MB out of the full 4G memory is ***NOT*** a feature of a 32 bit kernel. As when I compare my kernel config with Klaus Knopper's kernel config, is likely due to the target processor architecture which was chosen. He chose a CONFIG_M486. I happened to have chosen CONFIG_M686. With a non-CONFIG_M486, I have an additional CONFIG_HIMEM64G at my disposal too.
06-30-2011, 01:20 AM
KnUser

Clearing more

Quote:

Originally Posted by kl522

Detecting 3039 MB out of the full 4G memory is ***NOT*** a feature of a 32 bit kernel. As when I compare my kernel config with Klaus Knopper's kernel config, is likely due to the target processor architecture which was chosen. He chose a CONFIG_M486. I happened to have chosen CONFIG_M686. With a non-CONFIG_M486, I have an additional CONFIG_HIMEM64G at my disposal too.

Dear kl522, your defense of the kernel is commendable but the alleged/veiled attack to the 32-bit kernel from my side is not so (an attack, I mean).

I stated clearly that whatever it be (GRUB4DOS 0.4.4, Linux Kernel 2.6.37 (32b) or any other component) takes 33 MB RAM in 32-bit mode for booting purposes, by the sole calculation of 3072MB-3039MB==33MB. Is not my intention to blame none particulary in a special way. What I mean is that it is mathematically true that 3039 is NOT EQUAL to 3072. Perhaps I find a bit hard to explain myself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KnUser

It seems GRUB4DOS 0.4.4, Linux Kernel 2.6.37 (32b) or any other component takes 33 MB RAM in 32-bit mode for booting purposes, 3039MB+33MB==3072MB (3GB) and 136 MB RAM in 64-bit mode, 3960MB+136MB==4096MB (4GB).

Again, thanks kl522.

I'll be a bit busy the next days so I'll try to attend this thread and schedule the aforementioned ISO customizations for a later moment but any ideas/comments relating to the topic of this thread are welcome.
06-30-2011, 02:33 AM
kl522

I failed to understand the need to do any calculation.

Sure, when the bootloader such as grub4dos boots up, it needs memory. But when linux kernel takes over, it reclaims all the memory used by any other previous program(s). As a matter of fact as proven on my notebook when I booted using grub4dos, I still have full access to 4G of memory on my 32bit kernel. I don't have more than 4G of memory, otherwise I could even prove that I have access to 64G of memory on my 32bit kernel.
07-01-2011, 05:41 PM
Capricorny

I don't think it is very fruitful to discuss upper memory for 32-bits processors. In my first reply, I just wanted to point out that the "non-detection" is quite normal, and I would hardly call it an error that Knoppix is configured more restrictively than possible with the latest gen processors. And what really makes this a non-issue, is - I also pointed this out - if one needs to use all RAM, start in 64-bits mode. (To stuff a 32-bits machine with 4+ GB RAM seems rather meaningless to me, but it can of course be done, kind of retrocomputing bringing back memories of 16-bits computing and a total of 20 bits address space. 64G addressing (32+4 bits) on 32-bits is analogous, and to me hardly more attractive when you get a decent 64-bits computer for a few hundred dollars.

I'd like to get back to discussing booting. I personally think grub4dos may be the best way to go, legacy grub is too limited and grub2 has gone astray.