Seriously Miffed @ KDE!!! PLEASE HELP!!!

[j.drake]

Well, Jorge, you're doing better than I am. I guess there are (gulp) some benefits to MSW.

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Hi J!

By MSW do you mean, may heaven forfend, M$ Word or M$ WINDOZE?

OMG, BTW, I just figured out why I'm not getting the black text from VIM! The so-called black text is that text that was color coded black by KATE. The problem is that VIM acts like a Konsole Shell and defaults to white on black text for the "black"text. The colored text (not black) is ok. When I change the color schema to black on white everything prints from VIM to mrg (my printer) in color text just fine including the black text.

This is also why my *.ps and *.pdf files didn't display the "black" text on-screen and didn't print it either. VIM was converting to *.ps or *.pdf with white text! I just figured that out by printing test.cc from GVIM which adds some GUI-styled pull-down menus and defaults to black on white! Also, after changing the schema in VIM, I was able to create *.ps and *.pdf files that were complete with "black" text and printed everything fine.

You can also change the size of the font from "huge" to "small" do get a normal print-out. I wonder if there's a way to get VIM or GVIM not to print all those crazy "~" symbols down the length of the page.

Still, the original problem remains, why do KATE and KWRITE freeze when trying to print in color text????

Regards,

[j.drake]

By MSW do you mean, may heaven forfend, M$ Word or M$ WINDOZE?

MSW = MS Windows. If MSW had ever given me half the trouble that this OS has, or been as difficult to troubleshoot, I would have switched to Mac a long time ago. OTOH, I'm just playin' now. That's why I like Knoppix. Being on a bootable CD, there's no marriage, and I can go back whenever I want. If I had to actually rely on this to earn a living or get an education, I would have switched distros a while back. Sort of supports the get what you pay for theme.

I know that's a controversial thing to say here. I read somewhere that Unix fans love Unix and Linux fans hate MS. But MS would have gone bankrupt sometime before the DOS 3.3 release if they had ever turned loose of an OS that couldn't print.

That having been said, I know from talking to others that this release is more exception than rule, and that overall, Linux has by far more stability. It's just not ready to be a mainstream UI, not yet. But it will. And I want to be prepared for it when it happens.

MSW, in the context I mentioned, <> MS Word, which, as far as I'm concerned, is all but completely irrelevant now that we have OpenOffice for free, and both StarOffice and WordPerfect suites have become dirt cheap. There's no justification any more for paying good money for MS Word or MSOffice, IMNSHO.

Anyway, I'm still frustrated. Maybe I'll feel differently if I can ever get the stupid thing to print its own name.

[Edwin]

Well, three pages to this thread already. How nice ;=)

First, to cheer ourselves up a little we can think of people trying to trouble-shoot this sort of problems on Windows.......They get worthless stack-dumps, we get nice log-files.....:=))

After configuring the printer, the error_log was like my last post.

Ok, this output matches the output I get when I boot from CD and set up a printer. Except of course for the differences in printer name and device assignment (for me it is USB).
So the printer set-up is not the problem, right?

JobX = test.cc printed from KATE to mrg (HP DeskJet 930C). This did not print anything (should have been in color text) + KATE froze! There was no entry for this job (should have been Job4) in the error_log....

I am going to think aloud again. Everyone, please check my logic.

- Cups was invented to be able to print to any device: from the el cheapo Epson junk that sits on my desk to a $40,000 high-resolution RIP-printer.
- To do this it uses the concept of filters. These filters can be chained. For this to work the output of a filter must be in a format that the next filter understands.
- Unix programs, when printing, output PostScript or raw text.
- When text, cups converts it to PostScript. That's the 'texttops' filter in the log.
- Now we have PostScript. Cups uses the 'pstops' filter to convert it in a PS-file that the next filter will understand.
- If you're so lucky to have a PostScript printer the PS-file is piped to the printer.
- if you are not so lucky: what happens next is device-dependant. Meaning, cups needs information from the printer-driver and/or PPD. Why I think this I'll explain later.

Now, Kate produces PostScript, even when printing a plain (not colored-coded) file. I had hoped things would fail in the device-dependant part of the processing. But evidently we don't even get that far. And that just does not make sense. I can buy that somehow Kate makes a mistake when producing her PS file. And that my driver is more forgiving than yours.
But having Kate crash/freeze when doing her job on your system and not on mine? And we are talking about a CD-boot here. Maybe that whale-theory is not so bad after all. Or it is global warming. A disruption of the earth-magnetic field?

If you haven't given up by now, haven't punched out your computer, and are willing to to do some more trouble-shouting here is three things you can do:
- From Kate, with test.cc, which you know will not print, print and choose 'print preview' in the dialog. What happens? A freeze or a window showing a preview? Are the colors there?
- Before outputting the line 'Adding start banner page....etc' in the log, a lot has already happened in cups. Set the log-level in cups to 'debug'. This will produce some 1000 lines per print-job. So do this after setting up your printer and only on a print-job known to fail (test.cc from Kate). Start at the end of the log and see where the error occurs. If you really want to have some fun set the level to 'detailed debug information': that will produce some 5000 lines per job.
- Download the new version of Knoppix and see what happens there. (my gut-feeling is it will not work, but who knows)
- Real desperate shot in the dark here (and read that as really, really desperate): disable spooling, send to the printer direct (won't work either, but who knows)

Otherwise, you have discovered a few work-arounds for this problem. Resort to those. I am sure that the syntax-coloring in Kate and VIM or GVIM can be matched.

And now why do I think that the processing in cups after that 'pstops' filter is device-dependant? From your log you can see that only one filter is applied: 'foomatic-rip".
In my log two filters are applied: 'pstoraster' and 'rastertoprinter'.
I set up a new named printer (same brand and model) but choose another driver. My normal driver is 'cups+gimp'. The new driver was called 'foomatic+gimp+print ijs'.
That driver works as well, but the log showed that only one filter was applied: 'cupsomatic'.

Well, this was a long post. I hope it made some sense.
Anyone discovering flaws in it: please point them out. Flaming allowed ;=)

Regards,

- - Edwin

[Edwin]

I don't want to turn this in a OS-war; there are better places for that. But I can't resist this.

But MS would have gone bankrupt sometime before the DOS 3.3 release if they had ever turned loose of an OS that couldn't print.

Well actually they have done that. It was called Windows 3.11. I don't know which version of DOS it used, but printing anything over 20 pages (be it text or WORD) crashed any computer we had in our office then. Found a stagiaire that needed to print her report for an evalution the next day in tears one evening (and six crashed computers). Brought my Mac to the rescue. Printed the report. Stagiaire happy. Her teacher (the next day) happy too.

Thank you MicroSoft. I spend the rest of the evening sorting out the crashed computers.

But the game-plan was to sort out the stagiaire.

Cheers,

- - Edwin

[Stephen]

[quote="j.drake"]

I know that's a controversial thing to say here. I read somewhere that Unix fans love Unix and Linux fans hate MS. But MS would have gone bankrupt sometime before the DOS 3.3 release if they had ever turned loose of an OS that couldn't print.

I don't think hate is the word I think total and utter disgust for a morally bankrupt company would be more like it. And speaking of bankrupt just how was that supposed to happen when every X86 computer produced had to pay the MS tax for that wonder of an OS that was DOS/Windows even if you did not have any intention of installing I remember having many arguments on the phone with suppliers telling them were putting Novel on this machine we don't need a DOS license they would say no that's just how it is you want the computer you pay MS and it is still that way today for the most part. For a company that has extorted as much money from the computing public as it has it should have the most secure reliable OS on the planet but sadly that is not the case and they don't even seem to care. Just my 2 cents and worth every penny.

[paradocs]

Hi Mr.G

I think we need a philosophical approach here--
like when a tree falls where no one is present,
is there any noise?

I expect that VIM not printing black has to
do with a similar paradox. If you assume a
black background and you print in black --
is there any printing there?

If you put black paper in your printer you
would never miss the black print -- voila!

Best Wishes
paradocs

[j.drake]

Well actually they have done that. It was called Windows 3.11. I don't know which version of DOS it used, but printing anything over 20 pages (be it text or WORD) crashed any computer we had in our office then.

All I know is that it's 20 pages more than I've managed to get so far!

[A. Jorge Garcia]

Edwin:
So as not to reinvent the wheel, I'm going to try 2003.0725 first just in case Klauss's KDE updates fixes things!

Paradox:
I like your style - very funny. BTW, I almost did put black paper in my printer....

J:
You mean you can't print ANYTHING at all??? What printer are you printing to? What driver does CUPS assign it? What kind of file are you printing? What's your error_log look like? Are you printing with lp or what app are your printing from?

To All:
Well now at least all the "black" text problem is obviated! Sorry, I introduced that problem by way of trying to track down the color printing problem from KATE. Unfortunately, this only served to obfiscate the original problem!

Regards,

[j.drake]

You mean you can't print ANYTHING at all??? What printer are you printing to? What driver does CUPS assign it? What kind of file are you printing? What's your error_log look like? Are you printing with lp or what app are your printing from?

Squat. Zip, Zero, Nada. Printer won't dance, hum, shake or do anything. My efforts, and the responses from the OS are chronicled in the other thread. I'm not familiar enough with the OS to snag an error log. Tell me how, and I'll try to post one this weekend, if you and the others would be kind enough to help. I'm most grateful for the help I've gotten thus far, but I got the impression from the other post that I'm just stuck without printing until the next release (assuming that it fixes the bug).

I have 2 printers, and Epson Stylus C40UX color inkjet, which someone (I think Stephen, IIRC) pointed out is supposed to work perfectly; the other is a Brother laser all-in-one (MFC-6800). See, I can't even get through the printer setup - the printers are blissfully ignorant of Knoppix's sheer existence in the world, and have absolutely no idea that anyone is attempting to send output their way. Originally, KDE was telling me that I lacked permissions to set up printers, then someone told me how to set up a root password and run the wizard as an administrator. KDE finally recognized the Epson (or said it did), but returned an error when I tried to print a test page. The Brother didn't even make it that far. As far as apps and document types are concerned, I haven't made it that far - I'm still trying to get a test page. As for the driver, I thought CUPS was supposed to do that, so I haven't the vaguest.